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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPLANNING MINUTES 1948-06-24GRIPT OF PUBLIC _Th3 R Li UPJ IA TOWNSHIP i'roL'hxLLt HUR "-'DAY, TT= 24, 194.8 E. G3CRGE N. BENTLEY: The purpose of this Board as they sit here is to listen to any and all as they come in and then we will try to decide just what we are going to do. I ex- pect to turn thanmeeting over to Mr. Ambrose, our attorney, who will conduct it from here on. MR. JOHNS B. First, I will read the Notice of the Public nearing, so all of you will know the purpose of this meeting. (Reads Notice of Public Meeting). I will entertain. at this time anyone who is for the petition, and I will say this, that in view of the attendance here, we are not going to have time for too many speakers if we are going to take more than five minutes. Confine :your discussions, pro or con, to not more than five minutes and in addressing the Chair, please give your name and address so that the sanographer can record. it. Is there any one who s to speak for the change? Is the Petitioner hate who is MR. GORGE ISBELI Formerr hg_ for the change? ret i'y to the Zoning Board. I am a property owner of Livcnxa"owi?ship ,and am very much in favor of the Race Track coming out here. I don't think Churchill Downs has done Kentucky any harm and I don't think Niagara Falls did Buffalo any harm. I believe it will bring out- side revenue in here to be used to good tax purposes. ,hank you Mr. Isbel. EDWARD G. GERS, 3005 Curtis: I cnn't wee any reason why this project wouldn't be a very beneficial project to Livonia Township. I happened to be stationed in i^mi at hileah during the War and anybody who goes to Florida doesn't miss going to that track down there. • The Hileah Race Track is the most beautiful thing you ever saw, and if the sam buying this and are behind this very much in favor of it coming to Livonia Township. I am v said in paper, much in favor of Livonia Downs. MR. A.4BROS : Anyone else like to speak on the matter. BENERLEY STARK: Guess a lot of you think I am for it because I. am a horseman. I am also a theatre men. Most people I talk to seem to be afraid it will bring riff raft and bums in here. ',everybody in the house knowe Fisher. They have etzate and stables. Don't think We would call them riff raft. rybody knows . Ralf a million in taxes for schools is what we really need. J. "OO ROW , QOLEY, Minister of the rosd le Gardens Presbyterian Church. Passed a resolution, aece sent to the Zoning Board (Read resolution). The Race Track of the • idered is opposed. It would be harmful to the character of our small residential community. Our community would be controlled by racing interests, if they brought a ;great deal of money in hers-, and then I know the arguments that are being presented on the other side, but I feel that in the long run bringing in the race track would. be to the detriment of our ch;ilrlreaa. (Reverend Wooley presented another resolution from then. Presbytery of Detroit representing the 79 churches in Detroit and Layne County), WY' efeNE Is HARRY E. 4'OLfl I happen to be a_aAre no selfiela motive in mind at all. I wotle like to mention that I belong to ;tee Rotary Club he belongs. to, I happen to be cf the Protestant religion, and when Mr'. Wooley mentions that automatically when this track comas gardens, etc., will .automatically spring up, happen to know the rules and regulations. I have no ,elfi. have another ohs MR. Wooley taverns end beer a. Wooley doesn't mentioned before motives, but if we miss this beat, we will never that the individuals going to run this track w ra.cter of the demora don't think Mr. Wooley has looked into the plans that are ,progressing and the men who •are running it and are behind it. When he ?. mentions that the entire Protestant religion is against this track, Mr. 'iJooley is hot taking into consideration the men and the residents of this Township. tie is taking into consideration only the men the members of his church. I feel also that the taxpayers in this Township deserve this break* This Township is building up faster than we are keeping 'up with it. aNE;EiT SMERMAYI 15900 EUbbard Road: Mr. Chairman, I lived for eight years within four short blocks of the Detroit Race Track, and in all that tine I didn't go to the race track. I didn't go to the track until we lived there five years, and. in that time, as far as jeeoardizing our child- rents:morals, it was nothing like that. The people who came to the track came to see a race and bet on it, and they are alWays in a hurry, .and, wnen the racing season is over, they are gone, and the people vino take care sf horses, they come it and look for place to room and bos.d„ mind their owh lyusiness and don't even give you a good Acme. .RUE: Up, • Sernmerman, do 1 take it you are in favor of the change :or the proposed track. Yes. R. SITILLUT 77SOZI: I am an attorney .here in behalf of Sterling Wilson who resides directly across the street from the proposed race track sight, and. also LAr. Charles 'allson, who owns censidorable property adjoining the race track. I have listened with a great deal of interest to the remarks Made, and can't help but feel that many people have not looked at it from its width, depth and lengtn„ 02 thy wouldn't Come to this conclusion* When the residents surron.nding,the Detroit race track. found the race track there such a general nuisance that theytook them into court to restrain committing nuisances, and also to outlaw raeing. We should also remember that Miller granted them an injunction restraining nuisance and -made them clean up. Had to go to court to get that relief they would have 3. en and except it ,,,y-is such a revenge maker that our Supreme Court held the race ate, va.s not gambling, that ,din ball machines- are gambling, and race tracks you have to take into consider and then .fore it is a game of skill and not gambling; that is the only reason why we are confronted with this problem at present time. There has been a very flowery picture Painted here for you about all the neople whoare going to come into the community, Bing Crosby, etc., but you people ore going to be living with the horses. sifter the races are over, they certainly don't want the race track in their front yard. Livonia nship has always been known as a fine residential community, and why for e. few dollars you would want to contaminate it by bringing into it a race track. The one gentleman speaker just said. it ithe first break ,e have ever had. I think if you took any honest opinion of the people surrounding Detroit race track at the present time they will tell you they are getting a break by getting it out here. And the State of Michi ga_n it self doesn't want it. It hes been at the Detroit to 15 years, and the State of blichigan doesn't want it en state erty, it ix too mach of a headache e d you people say it dn't lose it. `'here i a also a further •question, our has held several times that you cannot rezone the,e,zones unless it relates to public health, morals of the people, etc. ipae,peorole break ti;e have ever r who purchased Here relied upon zi ai r C: ids c: urt restrictions promulgated by the Zoning Board here in the Taw Now you propose to turn around and change it around. I don't see how anyone could stretch their imagination so far about three or four hundred stables with a lot of filthy horses. GE;2 S RESTCK: I represent the Shelden Land Co. iymouth, 32121 Plymouth Road, and I am very _,leased to be here because contrary to the last gentlesan, I am a lover of horses. I think the Thoroughbred Club proposition that has been 4. presented to our community, by a gentleman of the racing assoc- 'ion that is pl,anninto locate herey ie 'a very fine natleman. and I thought maybe I. was ' onething to the entire proposition of horse racing, more so than I have ever thought before, and he left the entire community of Rosedale Gardens with the thought that there is absolutely no harm to horse -racing, and I agreed with. him. You have got to be a horse lover in order to be tuned to_it. Now if you are not tuned to it, you are against horse racing. We at Rosedale Gardens, g to be ma ber of the Sheldon Land Company, do not say one way or ano;:her' th you should go for or, against it, but zre do say this, that as get to be confronted with one thing. property owner We have Property is important - that is life just as much as death and. taxes. .T+_f W cu want horse racing as a jolly sort of side issue, ine, :`` aeld.on. o be {dfvl of the feet that we own anV' 4a'""1! 1 not you people here are •i•'.' a`.`ty o ners, w o think that t'h y wish thflt you be mindful of the fact that in a few years your property z^i:ht dev ivate or it might lacrosse in value. That is up to you, n.d after I have asked the Question I will be through after c'operty. et to it one bit, but as s ruestion that I have If anyone can point out to me that propert ased in value around a race track, I would like to have them do sip, to ;point to whatever race re is the entire country where they have increased in value.. That is up to you. Spe ak Sheldon Land Company not ? Tiown: I think this r n represents the . wonderful ”losnan. Being a real estate man myself, the Rosedale Gardens is only one -fifth of the entire area of Livonia Township. ' `" :toms W. Chic o, We came out in thi :Si sL• 27'vo W. h community. Chicago becaause - now. they put a m ac t'1E C in out here, I hope they will furnish ambulances to take •our children back and forth to the hosr1 every time they need it. Also, as far as giving ; 15,00v.CO for a home. '.rte bought on Mm`est 5. more taxes for our schools, but how many more children are coming in to attend schools. If there is going to be a large group of people employed, they are bound to brine their families if they liked it over by the race track so well, why did he come out here. We didn't come out here to rent rooms. We don't want rooming houses or boarding houses, we just want a good community for our children. MR. ROAD, 28290 TV. Seven Mile: I am in favor of the track. I believe it will be an asset to the community, and as far as traffic, we have traffic on Seven Mile every day during racing season at Northville. We'd be better off if we had a •race track here. 3RS.TULL, 15990 Harrison Road: First, I want to correct a. sta:tem.ent that was made that Mir. 'iboley represented only Presbyterian_ people. I am from Hope Chapel. We are all against it; in fact, I could say almost all churches are against it. I have a home over in Livonia Township. We came out here because we liked the community and I won't stay after the race c omes. M. T _RNS, 27681 V . Chicago. I have a question first. When you say that the acreage that is going to be taken up adjoins the continuation of West Chicago, how far toward that end does it go? (Discussion by Chairand Board) Three-cuarters of a mile west of Middlebelt Road. It ends at 3/1+ of a mile west of Middlebelt. MR. TB : How far between Plymouth and Joy Road are you going?' (CHAIR) To West Chicago Boulevard or Road. id.R. TERNS (Continuing) I would like to say for one thing, we are not in favor taf it, like my wife stated, . we bought in this community to get away from traffic. West Chicago at the present time is u dead street. In spite of the fact that it is now dead and has very little traffic, the Wayne County Road Cora - mission can tell you they have to put the posts up around the guard rail to keep people from tearing through there with cars. There is always somepne continuously mocking the posts around. '.s'ahat is it going to be when you get the race track traffic com- ing out here. You say it.is going.to be bounded in the corner of West. Chicago and Middlehelt, which means they will have cars parked, maybe some people like ears parked on their front lawns and making a quarter every now and then. (Chair) Any enterprise coming into the community must ,}revide adequate parking facilities under the ordinance of Livonia. TEENS) Continuing) There will be cars parked all along; the highways.,e will have a terrible traffic con- dition you will never get rid of. When this race track comes in the first man that comes along and gives me a. price for my place, he can have it. C. W. F IG S: 30320. W. Six Mile Road: I came here• tonight with an open mind,. and so far I haven't made up my mind whether I am for or against this proposition. There is one thing I don't like as a spectator that is the unsportsmanlike attitude of W_ie people here, and when one Plan who was really saying some- thing,, especially from a legal point of view, and i.f they are so tied up with sports, surely they can be good sportsmen. If I have any time allotted to me after I have said a word or two, I would like to have this man continue. The reason I don't know whether I am for or against it, when I see people like the Wolfs are in favor of this proposition, the main motive they have for being for this, of eour is to get money to continue school atione. apparently that is tee main thing in their mind. I have lived here for 16 years and the way taxes are going up is terrible. The more ororierty you own the worse the situation seems. I doesn't make any difference whether you double, treble I live on a small salary. I am very much interested in not 7. having taxes get beyond what I can afford to pay. I am interested in any way vJe can increase the tax revenue. However, I wouldn't be in favor of selling my sould in order to live an easier life as far as my taxes are concerned. I am a lawyer as several of these other people are, and I am inclined to look at this from a legal point of view - that gambling has always been illegal, and as this man, speaking awhile ago, referred to the situation in Michigan where the Supreme Court has apparently let down the bars as far as horse racing and legalized it. I believe this is going to be a long drawn out fight. You cannot disregard the legal aspect. There was one point that this tarn made a few moments ago, when you have spot zoning and you want to change a big area, the question_ of people's morals and the general benefit to the community at large will be followod out by the courts. This natter is not over. I teach law in the day.. I am. interested in all these phases,. T_ would like to have this man say a few more words. I`USE LL (REru_'.NED) It has been mentioned since I talked - in fact, the have heard a great deal about the increased revenues in - the Township will realize as a result of this race track, but.,1 wish to point out tine increased services which • you are going to have to render, which will probably eat all that up. Think of the increased political protection, the increased which fire protection you are going to have to provide/ail the other municipalities have found so burdensome and get out of control occasionally. I for one am raising a family INU . Gv e don't have a race track. If for any reason this proposition should fall through and the Township Board decides not to rezone, I certainly hope they don't try to pick on Dearborn to locate their race track. The notables, Bing Crosby and. the other celebrities, they are not going to be in here living with you, but. their horses will be here with you. I think you should take into consideration the•peopll like Charlie Wilson and St.erling Wilson who come here to live because they like the, people in it and the community .as it is - not somebody who comes in for- a couple of years. The celebrities will leave but the undesir- ables will stay. with you. (Speaker not named) Wasn't it Charlie Wilson that sat a price on his farm and when they went there to get the option he backed out because he would have to pay a big income tax. C:Ea LE.S WILSON: I am not for or against ra:eing. I don't bet on horses. That is neither here nor there. I would if I were there, but when a man says that. I offered my property for a certain price and then backed out on it, it is not so, and the real estate men here at this time will tell you, if they tell you the truth, that is not so. I have lived in Livonia Township before the most of you people did. I have lived here wa s a small boy. I went to school at Elm School. We own property in Livonia. Town - chip, my grandfather and my father and I own property and still own a lot of property and we have always paid taxes and paid them on time. We happen to be the property owners that own the property on the south of this property. It is a mile long, it is 80 acres and runs up south side, say possibly on across the road from this property, and if this property is changed,.if the zoning on this property is changed, it is going to jeopardize or ruin the prices of the property around this race track. Now if we are going to change, let's change it all. I don't think we should draw any lines. West Chicago doesn't go beyond Middlebelt Road. Now I certainly know something about -that. The property has been offered to be donated to the county if they would pave lest Chicago from Middlebelt to Merriman Road. We are very much opposed to this thing and our property adjoins on all sides. I am. not for or against horse racing. C. ROBERT CARLSON, 11320 Arden: Just what this attorney said a moment ago, I an neither' for nor against horse racing as such, I have been raised in a christian family, I have never attended a race in my life; being on the school board, I. can't spe_k,fcr the Board, that the Board has either sanctioned, condoned nor otherwise. We haven't asked as a body what Mr. Bentley thinks or some of the other men think. I don't know but I would like to hear what people whose property adjoins or comes within 1/4 of a mile or so, think of it. Some people from Rosedale I would like to hear. PAJL SWEET, Blackburn; I would like to ask we won't have the Fisher Brothers and. the Crosbys. They won't be. living next to the race track. MARY C' IO0i a,, 27510 Wk it.comb: A resident of Livonia Township for over eight years, I am, raising a i'wnily, oldest boy 18; very proud of my family. "you can put Livonia Township o map is we will show the people the moral character of our community by putting it above any pieces of silver we might get. BILL BAR:LO1 15104 MerriTn: This lady mist be very proud of her family, but she isn't sure of it, or she wouldn't, oppose the track. As far as the morals. if the. children are raised -right, they wouldn't be affected, by a rape track. B C.. ;UI.LBOPSV,. 11000 Upper: I just live, I have lived out here as taxpayer for 11 years. My property adjoins the West section of. this race track property. I an nsite interested in what happens. As T understand it the plans for this race track call for stabling and handling hundreds of horses. I don't know how many, I wonder, I am not opposed to racing, betting or gambling, one way or another; but I wonder how many people would enjoy the prospect of living close to a stable with hundreds of horses. If you ever smelled them in the summer time, you know what I mean, I have 10. ridden horses myself, been around them,been around mounted ,police- man in Detroit. You can smell them a block oft. my interest is what is going to -happen to. the community that lives around it. Certainly I have a selfish interest, anyof you people would have who have money invested in property, and from that stand- point I can't help but somewhat be against the• proposition. (THE CHAIR) 'ire have with us Mr. Lee Harding, the Engineer of the firm that proposes to construct the race track, and I will ask that you give your ears to him, if you can, and see what he has to offer you. (UNKNOWN SPEA ER) Five minutes, Mr. Harding. R. H RDING: I am willing to speak five minutes, five seconds or an hour. I :am also very willing to not speak at ali,. but I would like to present and speak for one purpose, and that purpose is to shed some light and not heat, on the .subject of the race track in Livonia. There k4a.s been a. great deal of talk and rumour and misinformation. This Board is entitled to a recitation of the facts with regard to the Thoroughbred Turf Club, how it happened to come here, has done, and its plans. I have a statement I grant to read first:: (Reads) Hands photostatic copy of document to Chair. (Continues) We have looked at miry prospective sites for the track, all of which were available and offered for that purpose. Among these were four other sites in this Township, namely, the Ryder property, the Nerarafn property, and the Filson property, and that _property diagonally opposite the Wilson property also. Also other properties i;� other sections of Greater Detroit, some of which are currently being mentioned, in newspaper stories. Aster long and care- ful deliberation we concluded the site now under discussion 11. Democracy at work. All I ask is ra fair hearing, I want to give you the facts. Tou can't intelligently act upon this petition or present a petition which will do you justice, and I Assure you you can't get the facts in five minutes. f 'ant to take just a moment to complete the regulations of this operation. I would like to talk about some of the things that you have mentioned.here, the problem of children, the problem of horses, the problem of stable areas, and 1 have asked for your benefit here tonight, c man whom I never saw before, who happens to be the mayor of the Town- ship of Oceanport in New Jersey, where the tliarrouth Park Jockey Club, which is operated by the same people who are members of this group, which stands for everything that is finest in this industry. I asked him to come here. I thought he could honest- ly answer the Questions in'your mind, and which would also be on mine if I sa:t in your seats, the gentleman is not only the mayor but the Comm ner of Police, a native of that town, has occupied present position for a number of six or seven years; before that we ever had a track, the Marmouth Park in New Jersey. We have 230 acres, approximately, on the south side of ply outh, and on the West of Middlebelt, in one piece, rectangular the exception of that property on which the greenhouse sits and the small piece next to it. That property will be developM primarily as follows: In the area next to Middlebelt will be the racing strip with en infield garden, a lake, fencel on the outside and. on the outside of that will be a hedge which will protect the property and the neighbors from the operation; the location of a clubhouse and a grandstand, which is >. beautiful building. I have _pictures which I will be glad to pass out. This area has been mentioned represents the stable areas where there will be stables for approximately 1000 horses, represents parking and landscaping facilities. On 80 acres which lie on the outside of Plymouth and. likewise on the West of Middlebelt 12. E. P. E`;TKaq, 11400 Melrose: I have been a resident for seven years and I want to support this.gentleman and thank the mayor for being with us, .and I think we ought to thank you for the Racing Association retaining him to come. I am very much interested in the progress of the Township of Livonia. I am very much interested in this fo,.000 or $90,000 of tax money that can come frog. the track. I am disappointed that it the last hour or two it has fallen from a halt million. But $80,000 or 090,000 is. a. lot of Money. However, we must recognize that we do not get something for nothing. If we are going to get 80,000 or 00,000 of tax money, then we must pay something _or that privilege. I would like to submit to you five points. These will be in the nature of a. summary of my of the things that have been said here earlier this evening. Five points, which you as citizens of Livonia. Town Ship should consider because these five factors are gains; to enter the coot to you of having the race track at Livo First, Y want to recall to your mind the traffic hazard. It is inconceivable to bring a crowd of people together in a hurry, such as at Livonia, without having a traffic' problem, with all due respect to our good mayor we areoin to have a traffic problem. That Means two things; first d: eyand time is money to all of us, whether it is leisure or business time. As traffic increases, traffic accidents increase, so we are going to have more accidents. Property damage can be evauiated, but bodily injury and death cannot be, and 1 don't think there is anyone here in the room that would but a value on the life of anyone in your own family. Second, the decreased property values that has been mentioned here, but only in respect to the mice track itself. I should like to call to your attention the fact that the race track will attract many other things.. hot dog stands, hamburg joints and beer parlors will litter:every section. 13.. I ask you to look at the south side of Plymouth Road between Farmington and Wayne Roads; that collection of shacks would depreciate values anywhere. The third point I want to rake, the third item that will appear on your price tag is the increased welfare lead. 3'e have a eegment of. our popu3'ation in Livonia Township that runs on the economic fringes, any slight financial adjustment throws them into chaos. We are bringing this race track into Livonia, introducing gambling; gambling is a disease, it lives lies dormant in the blood of nan.y of us. we are going to spread. that disease. We are gain.g to because many of those people who are on. the economic fringe are going to topple over. They are going to be welfare clients, and as welfare clients,, you and. I will support them. The fourc. point. The fourth t in un your price tag that 'I should like to call your attention to is increased crime. in one section of this Township we have gone through a period of robbery, of window peeping. I say to you that it causes.a lot of uncertainty and fear and we in that section do not want to repeat that process, and I know you do not want to repeat it neither; that was caused by only one man, now when you are bringing into the community in Livonia the employees of the track but others that core with it, tz s people will be mental and .coral degenerates; therefore you can multiply the mental worry that this community suffered during the ;a:t year many times, because those people are ,;,Ding to be running loose, robbery and rape will be rampant in your territory. If only one of the fine girls we have in this Township is raped or attacked by those because of your race track, the price is too much. The defamation of•youth.. Much of the argument that has been presented in view of the race track have called atten- tion to the eighty or ninety thousand dollars of tax money 14. very shrewdly the proponents of the track have turned this into the building of new schools and additional tax money, et.c. Education goes. far beyond the erecting .of find edifices. Educa- tion is the building of character dae establishment of the foundation of citizenship for the children to use in their later years. Character is the very foundation of education and I submit to you, if we build our addition_=1 institutions through a medium that will scrap the character from beneath them, then we will build. merely a hollow shell. We ere building on quicksand,. and so as you think of this proposition ladies and gentlemen, I submit to you th t there will be at least five items on the price tag to Which you should give onsiderion. The increased taxes represent two dollars oeS taxpayer, well, r16,000..00 or 17,000.00 four dollars a piece. Can we afford. the four dollars apiece to have this rriee tag an us? O&R jCtD.N, 9401 Cranston Gardens: I don't think, it is right thatwe Condemn somebody's house, be- cause everybody's home is his castle. a little more fortunate, but because son u3T).c�.11e:c than mine, on Plymouth Road, it t.i.. sl cia is 1iun' z house That shows to Sr'a'r2 ''u is on the Ju'1;si e. OLLIE cIN OSE, 11311 r Be. wick. I want to oppose t track only. TGITT' WALKER, 15114 Piedmont, Detroit: I am a tarp I own 40 rods frontage immediately apposite in Ro,ci- and 40rods immediately opposite the horse stable, but going to have fine homes on one side, a race track on the other; fine people on one side -and an employer on the other side that finds it necessary to have his employees fingerprinted. Ci iRLr.S. ' '.LKLP. 12904 Starke RoadI think one of the biggest questions asked tonight was concerning traffic. Now according to the way some people talk, 1 don't believe they understand exactly. Plymouth .toad I travel every day and I 15. r dens are have never run into any children and Ihave never seen any confusion. of a group of people on the road. This track is not going to be any traffic hazard, and it is not going to put any traffic through Rosedale Gardens. According to the questions asked a- lot are worried about cars through the Gardens; some may think traffic from the track is going through the Gardens. I have made a very careful survey. No reason Why the traffic in Rosedale. Gardens should be increased by a race track. The traffic created. by the track will be con- trary to the traffic which is normally moving on the highways• at the time -the track travel is moving. MR. DELAVERGtTE, 11010 Berwick: Mr. Harding will Chicago Boulevard be put through to Merriman Eofade Will that create additional travel i.n _Ro edale Gardens. ,kre you sure it Won't be nut throu :? I have never asked the Commission whether Chicago Road would go through from Uiddlebelt to Merriman, I think_' Mr. Wilson indicated that there had been an offer to t the land had been offered to the county to resurface the read. They don't have d don't intend to do it. 4%, as our interest is concerned, the only interest we would have • in Chicago Avenue being extended, being extended beyond Middle•= did belt, would be a. sharp strip about 1/4 mile surface, we we++a1e discuss that with the proper authorities, suggesting we would provide that roadway ourselves. We have no intereet and there is no reason. There are three entrances on Plymouth from the arking area end t e sup.ple2n.entary parking area empties onto Middlebelt, an exit only, not an entrance, may be used in days of high capacity, to take a very Mall part of the load out on the Chicago =vvenue extension. The purpose of the Chic ago Avenue extension is to van. horses into the track. If the Township or the County doesn't 16. cooperate with respect to- that will simply continue our entrance on our own land and put a. driveway tarougb I still call your attention to this. strip that amounts to about 1500 feet in length, being at the junction of Chicago and Middlebelt and going in 1000 feet, which is probably seven or eight tunes the length of this hall. It is pretty sure Chicago will not go on to Merriman. That is there is no reason as far as the track is concerned and no reason why traffic conditions in Rosedale should be affected that I know of. FRANCES TTERICH, 11320 Berwick, I am against the race track. 3TANIZY R ]1ICK, 10053 Wayne Road. One point to the Zoning Board, the race track should consider all of Livonia. TOwnsb.ip, not just Livonia Gardens. 'u am not for or against just making a suggestion to the board to thine it over. McDONALD, 10750 Laurel Avenue. I want to find out the difference, what is the difference in getting in a race trick and getting all your industries out here.. What is the difference in having a race track. 3OEN A. BURGESS, 9535 e Road. I have hea, d questions raised about undesirables that dare going to frequent the race track. I don't know if the coning Board has taken into consideration when they put the parkway through, but I would like to invite the people here to attend that parkway and see wh t tyre get and which we don't derive any taxes from. ,I have a uest.ion on the track. From 105 to 115 days of the year is the racing season. What happens to employees the remainder of the year, 17. P . HARD1'CG: The track operates, last year the Detroit Race Association_ operated 97 daYs• This year, I under- stund•is to operate "5 days. As a ratter of sound business, we t,.iiak th e Track in the Greater Detroit area should operate scat .more than 75 to 35 days. The additional days are the time it arrangement for a large segment of people, great es to get ready and to close up. This is re vacation find that of our mutuel ticket sellers and c>a.sriers,a number oi' our ticket sellers and ushers, come from the edteational institutions. They are that kind. of people; they go back to them. There is r segment who follow the sun. `shear bill come here in ttte..suinner and dvrn to the Min track in the winter. They. are very fine people, List) the horse peoj,le follow what they the Circuit of tYie various racing trsecks. The industry is only :seasonal. IG s:S, 11026 Cranston. One _uestion I would like to ask Mr. '_-hording, thy, in ,1). ..z.f rnia de they have these visible totalizing boards -and not in_Michigan. ME. HARPING. That of course is a matter of policy istei3nby tale officials or the Detroit Racing Association. In a • and '1an. to have the 1 ateht ecuipmeht sui3pli°ad `by the American aisei equipment ar_„d assures th patron an tion, s :Par as we are concerned, we expect track. which is the company that supplies that per cent foolproof, can't be t:.mpered with r ticket and an rionest return. to go on record against the There is one point, ali these gentlemen in sonnet- tion with this track 2 e very fine Lu ..inessjen, they are in business for the love of money they, get out of it. Most of the horses raced nowadays are organized as corporations to enable industralists, people to lose their money and still have fun. la. Horse racing is a. business to these people. If we come to de, pend on this tax money, these men can pull out and leave us, and we will be stuck if there is a -wide depression. Norse racing is going to draw from the Detroit area a number of undesirable people. It is -the most vicious sport, there is no sport requires as much ,police protection as horse racing does. Would have to pay 200 or 300 police to keep down the undesirables. MR. H, DING "+ e are investing$7,000,000. 'u'e don't intend to go away and leave :7,000,000..00. The average return on our budget to the stockholders of this track is around fiv seven. or eight per cent.,.if my mathenstics are any good, and that is about what you get from any similar business venture. e are trying to do something for racing.. It is a business, oz. industry. We are in the business. Somewhere in Detroit there should be a track of the character which we intend to supply. R. HARRy S. WOLFE: I happen to be one of the fellows selling the menthe track.close to 50 years I have lived here. 1 am interested in the wlet'are of this Township just.as such as anyone of you. `there are some Other interest I have. ;One of those is the faet that I have a 14. year old boy who is going to get his high school year in Livonia. iise can't h ve a gymnasium, a decent playground. Seventy per cent of our tat is school tax here in Livonia Township. The track will bring in approximately 460,.000.00 to 70,000.00 in school tax alone. We can afford to have a gymnasium. Now folks I am not concerned about that 14 year old boy of. mine being in wrong association with the people who come to this track, but I am interested in whether he kite, is proud of his high school. Unless he is the ordinary boy or girl can't rightfully be proud of their high• dred thousand dollars per year, which is about school unless they have the or 19. litieu for gymnasium and athletics. i am not in the leo worrisd about him being associated with somebody he shouldn't eaL=SOCir, to with. _ don't have to t:=11 him who to yociate. . s'' Y�iithe knows. y� jjust the sae as w van go down. town to Detroit or '.nywhere else and not get dead drunk. I am interested in the welfare of school because my boy has to go to tic. school.. The horses don't go to school. Youcan't expect . boy to be uenned uS3 in a. school and they can't go outside ''hen_ &t iS r .tn1.71s sleoting and storming. B. o-y 4.LLy 29970 SiZ MILE r E,:'T . 1 was in, Windsor whon ws had throe race trackst o s•ed to T ^.13J.blll�. .,�. am$'1" of 3'Ol +Ji- y-?.rygJ.../.f.'�:iyt the race track. �'J y f .a t; LnA, y 1 d b BLAC.f1dJUhE s Y am o :i. sed V o the race tract and r would like to see the Lon that have invested their money in this track, I doubt very muchif any one of them save w believe. With. tll due regard turd to all Dstreite<rs 1 he l.i.ve cr ot_ C•;ren 'iiil..e Rout:. not 1' thin a 1r'.ilo an '1 c.> °rs 1 b�ll�. re ,erned with the character of the ;cocle who are working at the ta' ck., but with thefloaters going around the country and who f equent race in the Summer months. t to g,,o ;n record moot of tracks, gore aren't 50 and to will be around thi .3..313. J { t• ° ovpose9d to the ,ace track. :r[' ZE 1. c`:r.'-.. 1H, w,.°uJ7 e1.t'tJze..• P dou't know if tt is 6ZLybody here who :... quaiified to ay y=slether he rsoe t'I"`3i is going to be :. dot rlra nt or benefit to t e oo mun:ity, The Detroit race track has bees_= remn.i.ssg fo is less thraru half a mile from :.h here to ge out there and see that subdivision, deteror k nd Palmer Woods people least. 1 think when you talk about race tracks e in hind the Northville track. If you are going to have that hind of a traok, 1 would. be opposed to it, and it is where you 'are going to have floaters that would tell you a race track is one of the worst things you ooul.d have in your community. 20. FtR D H B RKQB1d, 14020 Brookfield. would like to go on record as being in favor of the track. There has a lot been said here tonight pro and con. I believe we will never know and. never find out unless we give it a trial. We are here tonight to help the Board decide whether the change in zoning ordinance should be made in behalf of the said track. In the future, if we get a race track, we can come right back down here and see what can be done if things het a little bit rough. If we have a high school gymnasium and proper facilities for athletic activities, we won't have any juvenile delinquency. MR. REDNICKEI I would like to know what effect this going on record pro or con will have on the Zoning Board. ChATR: There is going to be a transcript of ,this meeting tongight and they will consider. before -- MR. Ri'DN7:C I would like to go on record for .the track. TONY 1iEPYA1 S., 32206 W. ago Boulevard. I would like to go on record as against it, as a member of the Board of Christian Education of the Board of Rosedale Presbytery. d CK WHITEBEAB, 31510 Plymouth Road. I would like to know from the Chair if there is going to be a. vote cast on this proposition, or is the Board going to got upcan the decision of what ha.s really been recorded by the secretary. CHAIM .The final determination under the laws of the State of Michigan rests With the Zoning Board. This is only a public hearing to express your views for or against the proposition. . C..IIR'.A`T: We are res"sly on the spot, this Zoning Board. There are a great many different opinions here tonight. T_ do think an expression from you as many as possible, should aid in our decision. There are a number of things the Zoning Board should take into account. First of all, the effect it may have on the more immediate people, whether they 21. do or do not want it. Second on the increased taxes f©r the Township. I am a merfner of the School Board. We know we do need money for building gymnasium for school, we take into con- sideration the returns it means to the Township. `: dhat effect it does have on those nearest to it; that side is more effected than the other side, because you are distant from it, but in the effect the taxes will. have amounts to just as much to the People on either side. - 0. W. Rf T'HBURNE, 945 Sutherland, Plymouth. I own 20 acres of land adjacent to the race track. I am for the race track. race track. to it. MRS. ROBERT 9615 Berwick. I am against the R. J. A BBA, 9924 Ardin. I 97,1 definitely opposed _D 'McCRr.D E, 9615 a..rd n. pposed to it. MR. .AND a'RS. 'MOM.,11320 Berwick. We are opposed to it, because the income from this so-called benefit we receive will come from the losses of those who bet on the races. I don't want any part from anybody's losses. M .S. JOHN CWiEIING, 12779 Starke Road. I am for the race track. CFESTER RROW'DEN, 12753 Starke Road. I am for it. H. PLETCIIER, 28111 W. Seven Mile Road. .I am for the races. FLORE CE SMILEY, 12712 Starke Road. I am for the track. I vas still for it when it was going to be within a halt mile from our house.. RICHIJT SMITH, 12329 Middiebelt. I am for it. J. J. YOUNG, 15110 Bembridge, I am for it, MR. ND MRS. aR90L , 9605 Ardin. We are opposed to it. it. AROLD ':LE0R W4, 111000 Fiubbel. I au opposed to in Livor. r4AE1 2 7120N, 30100 W. Six Mile. I am opposed to it. 1mD ,ic0Rs!LA.nY, 9615 f4 din. I „m ouposed to it. ", M. DYER, 12850 Starke, e. I am for. it. MR . O. M. DY},p{, +.2.850 Starke. I am for the tra& M. 1TANfE'R OT, 14074 :_rrxington Road. I don't live live in Rosedale. I believe the truck will help us. As far tas traffic, most of the cars will come from Detroit. 'R'r't, 15910 Flubbed Road. I ,am for it. 5469 S,nadyside. 14rould like my boy to go to Zcy col, I think just as Much of him as the horse lovers do of their horses, :%fe doesn't go to school in as good a school th:.', U1 +:.^'. 1BT ere triese horses are s &Dled, 1 would like my bey to be treated 1JERGOX„ ] 2921 ._ k it® If any of y*ou isvn coxe s the PTa nights, you know we need ^el.00la. a.. K. DALL3v, 2')908 Ma.ry1':;nd e que st"_on people who Who is goin to build track. I am for the track. 7,i 1. for it. -es _ am very much for cols like Ihave gone on I would like to ask oi .n ° to furnish sewer &Leeo'sals for all be here for throe !months of the MR . "+ L._ 02.1. P] .SOMEBODY 2.SKED Y3.3e sad i A Ze track. J am for .-2 S ERED. With respect to sewers. V:-.L MRUTTI, 11408 Melrose. I am in favor i00%. G. G. l,, Iri„ 124.34 e.iddlebelt. In favor. tiOLiv CCTl�^.,,��.,. 12779 Starke Read. Yes,. in favor. GR0t,, .ttr,Riaq. 12948 Starke Road. a-12J':I TANG, 13203 Hubbell, Detroit. Yes. ?$22C su. Seven ?.:lile. Yes. 23. GEORGE YOU7G, 15110 Eembridge. Yes. V LERA OSTRIU'D°ER, 14991 Bainbridge. Yes. LEO.i'sTl? Lea R, 15315 Shadyside. Yes Above is my residence, and ve also own a Louse on 12489 Hartell, less than a .quarter of a mile from the track. ROBE T C. PORTEcUS, 9911 Blackburn, Rosedale. Born and brought up in horse racing. In favor- of it. VERNON NYMAN., 10686 Laurel.. AGAINST IT. mow. IRENE POOL, 12837 Starke. I am for it. ALTER METSTER, 12730 Starke Road. Yes. OHAIM3;S B1_ GINI, 31735 Plymouth. Yes. LOJIS LeBAR, .15315 Shadyside, Yee, ELMORE and LONE iicNIEGE, 16008 Oak Drive. Yes. d need big industry and horse racing is big industry. L. D. 3EISde, 11306 Cavell. Yes. LOUIS TREZONI, 9619 ingrim. Yes. F. PERRY, 15640 Oporto. Yes. The Livonia Taxpayers jority of them the race track at our last meeting. :Lie- second Wednesday of June.It was the Taxpayers, �':.ssociation. dMOND P. THORPE, ANN THORPE•, 16013 Middlebeit. Yes. HELEN RUTSKI. Yes. VI{CL& MANNING, Seven Mile, niingtOn. Yes. JOEI'J MANN/NG► 33335 W. .even Mile, Ya.rr ington, Yes. RUBY B0bTA:R, 20418 Mayfield. Yes. 10BiRTB..u'MGARDPER,.. 30881 Schoolcrart. Yes. IRwN. J. WOLFS, 19015 Shadyside, Farmington. Yes. EVERETT T '»LS0 ,. 32150 Five -noble. Yes. JACK BLADES, 16015r�M dcllebelt. Yes. BL TRICE BO4s'i.~rR, 30885 ad. Six Mile. Yes. MARTHA McOL N1HAN, 15315 Shadyside. Yes. J.AIJES DIXON and wife, 9911 Cranston. Yes. LAURA. JGFSTSTON, 11032 Cranston. Yes. DONALD R. JOHINSON, 15153 £avouri. Yes. /ILLIAM LLOYD, 9109 Barwick. Yes,