HomeMy WebLinkAbout1,181 - January 11, 2022 signedMINUTES OF THE 1,181st PUBLIC HEARINGS AND REGULAR MEETING
HELD BY THE CITY PLANNING COMMISSION
OF THE CITY OF LIVONIA
On Tuesday, January 11, 2022, the City Planning Commission of the City of
Livonia held its 1,1815t Public Hearing and Regular Meeting in the Livonia City Hall,
33000 Civic Center Drive, Livonia, Michigan,
Mr. Ian Wilshaw, Chairman, called the meeting to order at 7 p.m.
Members present: Glen Long Peter Ventura Sam Caramagno
Ian Wilshaw
Members absent: Carol Smiley, Betsy McCue, David Bongero
Mr. Scott Miller, Planner IV, and Stephanie Reece, Program Supervisor, were also
present.
Chairman Wilshaw informed the audience that if a petition on tonight's agenda
involves a rezoning request, this Commission makes a recommendation to the City
Council who, in turn, will hold its own public hearing and make the final
determination as to whether a petition is approved or denied. The Planning
Commission holds the only public hearing on a request for preliminary plat and/or
vacating petition. The Commission's recommendation is forwarded to the City
Council for the final determination as to whether a plat is accepted or rejected. If a
petition requesting a waiver of use or site plan approval is denied tonight, the
petitioner has ten days in which to appeal the decision, in writing, to the City
Council. Resolutions adopted by the City Planning Commission become effective
seven (7) days after the date of adoption. The Planning Commission and the
professional staff have reviewed each of these petitions upon their filing. The staff
has furnished the Commission with both approving and denying resolutions, which
the Commission may, or may not, use depending on the outcome of the
proceedings tonight.
ITEM #1 PETITION 2021-10-01-07 Kassem Bazzi
Mr. Caramagno, Secretary, announced the first item on the agenda Petition 2021-
10-01-07 submitted by Kassem Bazzi, pursuant to Sections 13.13
and 13.15 of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance, requesting to
rezone the property at 27480 Five Mile Road, located on the north
side of Five Mile Road between Inkster Road and Foch Avenue in
the Southeast 'Y4 of Section 13, from NM1, Neighborhood
Multifamily to NM2, Neighborhood Multifamily — Maximum 4
Stories.
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Mr. Miller: This property is located on the north side of Five Mile Road
between Foch and Green Lane Avenue. It is 1.6 acres in size.
The current condition is vacant. Surrounding the property, you
have NM1 (Neighborhood Residential) to the north. To the east
and west there is C-1 (Local Business). Across the street to the
south of Five Mile Road there is N1 and N2, which are both
residential. NM2 zoning treats multiple dwellings and apartments
as a permitted use, subject to review and approval by the
Planning Commission and City Council. This zoning also allows
buildings up to four stories in height. The preliminary plan for the
development shows two buildings and a clubhouse. Each
building would contain six, two -bedroom units for a total of 12
units. The buildings will be three levels in height. On the north
side of the site there would be a 2,040 square foot one-story
clubhouse and outdoor pool area. Parking for this type of
development and the number of units, requires 24 parking
spaces. The site plan shows 43 parking spaces. The Future
Land Use Map shows this as medium density residential, which
is suitable for this type of development. That is the extent of the
proposal.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Miller. Do you have correspondence?
Mr. Miller: Yes. The first item is from the Engineering Division, dated
November 2, 2021, which reads as follows: 'In accordance with
your request, the Engineering Division has reviewed the above
referenced petition. We have no objections to the proposed
rezoning at this time. The subject parcel is assigned the address
of #27480 Five Mile Road. The existing parcel currently has
access to public water main and sanitary sewer owned by the City
of Livonia. Storm sewer owned by Wayne County is available
within the Five Mile Road right-of-way, so that any connections
will require a permit through the County. The developer will need
to meet current Engineering requirements for the proposed
project, including storm water detention per the latest version of
the Wayne County Storm Water Ordinance. It should be noted
that the developer will be required to obtain a permits through the
Wayne County Department of Public Service for any work within
the Five Mile Road right-of-way."The letter is signed by David W.
Lear, P.E., Assistant City Engineer. The next letter is from the
Finance Department, dated November 3, 2021, which reads as
follows: "I have reviewed the addresses connected with the
above noted petition. As there are no outstanding amounts
receivable, general or water and sewer, I have no objections to
the proposal." The letter is signed by Connie Kumpula, Chief
Accountant. The next letter is from the Treasurer's Department,
dated December 28, 2021, which reads as follows: "In
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accordance with your request, the Treasurer's Office has
reviewed the name and addresses connected with the above
noted petition. At this time there are taxes due, but they are not
delinquent, therefore I have no objections to the proposal." The
letter is signed by Lynda Scheel, Treasurer. That is the extent of
the correspondence.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Miller. With that we will go to our petitioner or
representative for our petitioner who is in the audience. You are
welcome to come forward to one of the podiums. We will need
your name and address for the record please.
Mohamed Bazzi, 6347 Appoline, Dearborn, MI, 48126.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, sir. You are representing our petitioner tonight. Is
there any additional information you would like to provide?
Mr. Bazzi: We are actually just trying to change it from NM1 to NM2 for a
specific reason. We are trying to put the garage on the lower
level so it will actually only be two and one-half stories, which we
can put in writing. It is already approved for two -stories, so all we
need is ... we wanted to put the garage on the bottom floor to make
it two and one-half stories. That is about it. I mean everything
else is intact unless anybody has any questions. I would be more
than happy to answer them to the best of my ability. My father
was supposed to be here. He caught Covid and the architect
actually is not here, so I would be more than happy to answer any
questions to my best ability.
Mr. Wilshaw: We appreciate that, Mr. Bazzi. What we will do is start with any
questions from our commissioners on this property and petition
and then we will hear from our audience members. Anyone on
the Commission wishing to ask any questions of our petitioner?
Mr. Ventura: Good evening, Mr. Bazzi. I am trying to understand your
reasoning when you say where you are putting the garage on the
main floor on the first story is only a half a story. Are you putting
it partially underground?
Mr. Bazzi: It is going to be lower level. It is going to be dug like a
condominium...) don't know....Mr....actually, John said that
somewhat of similar condominiums over at Bell Creek Condos.
Mr, Ventura: I'm sorry, I am not familiar with that. So, you are telling me that
the garage...you are going to drive down below the grade into the
garage?
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30318
Mr. Bazzi: It will be not all the way dug underground, no. It will be ... the way
he explained it is it will be two and half stories.
Mr. Ventura: Okay, I understand your answer to that, an you. I also see that
the planning staff recommended a couple of modifications to the
site plan. Number one, that the project be limited to two stories
and number two, that the buildings be moved closer to Five Mile
Road and number three, the pool house on site that you plan to
put on site be changed in orientation from going east to west to
north to south so that it is not as close to the neighbors as it is
now. Can you tell us why you haven't done those things?
Mr. Bazzi: Well, Mr. Ventura, I talked to John and he said that he is working
on that because the neighbors were saying that they don't want
a pool. They want trees and whatnot, so in regard to that we can
discuss it further into making it a park or complete grass and
trees. We have no problem with that. What was your other
concern? The first one?
Mr. Ventura: The staff recommended that the buildings be moved closer to
Five Mile Road.
Mr. Bazzi: Which will eliminate the parking in the front, correct?
Mr. Ventura: I believe that was why.
Mr. Bazzi: That is why we didn't want to do that. Because it is eliminating
parking out front and it wouldn't look the same. Side by side, the
buildings side by side would look a lot better and they are more
convenient for the garages in regard to where you are going to
have a garage facing Five Mile.
Mr. Ventura: Okay. I guess my last question would be why do you have so
much parking on the site that is not required?
Mr. Bazzi: They are just extra parking spots, that's all.
Mr. Ventura: So, there is no functional reason for that?
Mr. Bazzi: No.
Mr. Ventura: Alright, thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Ventura. Any other questions for our petitioner?
If not, I do want to point out that this is a rezoning request and our
main focus tonight is to look at the rezoning of the property from
NMI to NM2. There is going to, obviously, be some discussion
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30319
regarding the proposed site plan because we need to understand
why this change of zoning is being requested, however, the
details of the site plan itself and the layout of the property, the
materials used on the building, and those types of details will be
taken care of at a future site plan meeting if this petition proceeds
forward. I just want to at least point that out for everyone in our
audience. With that, I think if there are no further questions from
any of our commissioners ... Mr. Long, did you have one?
Mr. Long: There is email correspondence.
Mr. Wilshaw: We did receive...there is a number of letters that we have
received from residents in the area that will be into part of our
record as well. One of those notifications that we received today
that I want to make clear in the record is that it was discovered
that this property did not have a sign posted outside of it, which
is part of the process that the petitioner is required to go through
is to post a sign notifying that the rezoning is being proposed for
this property. With that I do want to make it clear that it was noted
and we will continue on with our meeting at this point. Is there
any other comments or questions from any of the
commissioners? If not, I am going to go to the audience and see
if there is any comments that anyone in our audience would like
to make on this petition, either for or against. Mr. Bazzi, you can
sit down for now. We will listen to the residents who wish to
speak. Good evening, sir. We will ask for your name and address
for our record.
Larry Czerwinski, 15852 Foch, Livonia, MI. I would like to first off tell you I am a
disabled veteran and I have trouble hearing. Thanks to the US
Navy. I am opposed to this change because that is a nice quiet
residential neighborhood. It is all one -family homes. That
apartment that you are talking about, I think will stand out like a
sore thumb. It will bring my property value down. Next thing I
need to know is, is this a Federal thing that you are doing or is it
some private guy wants to build these apartments?
Mr. Wilshaw: This is private, sir.
Mr. Czenwinski: It's private. 'Cause I was wondering if this was a federally funded
thing to hold Section 8 people. I want to know if they are going
to build something like that next to Obama and Martha's
Vineyard. That has been happening all over the country. They
are trying to integrate the neighborhoods. I am against that. If
they build one by Obama, they could build one by me. That is the
way I feel about it. My second thing is that I didn't hear that whole
introduction that you did about how this gets passed or not
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passed. The way I think, I didn't hear that whole scenario, but if
we are living in a democracy it is up to the citizens of Livonia not
appointed people or elected people to make that decision. I think
we can either take a vote of hands or put it on the ballot,
bA... 'cause I am sure a lot of people feel as strongly and it
should be up to the people of Livonia to make that decision. Not
two or three people, other than that I don't have much to say, but
I would like to have a vote on that as an option and all my
neighbors would as to what goes on down here.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, sir for your comments and I do want to acknowledge
your service to our country and say our appreciation for that. The
way the process works is we are going to make a
recommendation either approving, denying, or potentially tabling
this item to a future meeting. That is the three decisions that we
can make and that recommendation then goes to ... normally it
would go on to City Council and City Council ultimately is the one
that makes the decision. They are the elected representatives
that make these decisions.
Mr. Czerwinski: They should represent me and my thoughts.
Mr. Wilshaw: That is very true.
Mr. Czerwinski: Isn't that how democracy works?
Mr. Wilshaw: You are correct, sir. That is one of the reasons why we have this
public hearing is for you to be able to participate in the process
and express your views.
Mr. Czerwinski: City Council is all elected people?
Mr. Wilshaw: Correct.
Mr. Czerwinsle; : So, that means if they go through with it we have the power to
vote to get them out.
Mr. Wilshaw: Exactly. That is exactly how that works. So, what we do is, we
get your comments and we are going to factor in your comments
along with all the other information we received tonight and we
are going to try and make the best decision we can. That is kind
of what is going to happen tonight. Okay?
Mr. Czerwinski: So, in other words you make the best decision you can regardless
of these people?
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Mr. Wilshaw: That is not true. We try to make the best decision, what is best
for the citizens, for the community, and for the property owner
themselves. We try to factor in all those things.
Mr. Czerwinski: So, I guess my next question is, if they are so intent on building
this in my neighborhood, there is plenty of room in Detroit to build
apartment houses. I used to live there, I know what it is like.
There is lots of empty fields. Lots. There is plenty of places to
build apartments. We do have apartments down on Five Mile
close to Middlebelt, so if they are looking for a big place to build
a lot of apartments, go east of Telegraph, you will find it.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, we appreciate that. Thank you very much sir.
Mr Czerwinski: Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Is there anyone else wishing to speak for or against this
development? If so, feel free to come forward. Good evening
ma;am.
Cheryl St. Jean, 15458 Foch, Livonia, MI. I am speaking for my 98-year old
mother. She lives at 15458 Foch. I live at 15524 Foch. We have
three houses on this street. Our family. My home I have water
in the back part of my property already. There are four actual
houses, two on the right side of me going toward Five Mile. We
have overflow of water. We have had it since we have lived on
this street. We can't...I have a 1/3 of an acre going straight back.
We can't use that back part of the property due to water, which
we have standing right now. I am concerned that with them
putting all the clubhouse, the pool, the concrete, the garage, the
buildings, the weight of all that...I understand that they are going
to do their sewer, okay with that, but I am concerned that all this
that they are building somehow is going to come my way. Storm
water run-off, backflow, whatever. I am just really ... we are
already...I have... am I going to lose that part of my property
totally where I can't even cut my lawn. Also, I am concerned
about... are there going to be brick walls separating this
(inaudible) with the neighbors? Because some of us don't want
people looking in our house. You know, if you have two -stories,
those people on the top story are going to be seeing... you know.
The other thing is the dumpsters. We have a rat problem in this
neighborhood at certain times of the year and if there is going to
be dumpsters I am assuming the dumpsters are going to be
further back toward our properties versus closer to Five Mile.
What is going to happen with that? Are we going to have an
increase problem with that? I really think... this doesn't pertain to
this, but we had a real estate at the end of our street... we
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understand that has turned into a gun shop. So, now we have a
gun shop and then we have this, so when does it stop? What
more are you going to do? There is one more piece of empty
property on Five Mile that is west of our street. Has a beauty
shop in it... an empty lot. Gosh, what are your going to put there?
I understand that it is all about money or I think it is about money.
That is just my opinion, but when does it stop that we have to
have these kind of things? I don't really have a problem with what
is being built, it is just how much is going to be built on one... was
it one and a half acres?
Mr. Miller: 1.6
Mr. Wilshaw: 1.6
Ms. St.Jean: Alright, 1.6 acres all these on 1.6. My god I have a 1/3 of an acre
and I can't even imagine putting all this on there. Then garages?
I didn't even realize that and then 48 parking spots. I mean... so,
that means each condo...I mean I understand they are probably
going to need two cars because two people are going to live in it,
but gosh you know... that is in our backyard. If there aren't going
to be brick walls and they are just going to leave us with our, you
know, our wrought iron fences we have and you know privacy
fences, what... you are going to change our neighborhood. I can't
help but think it is going to drop our property value because we
have a gun shop and how we got this, but you know ... this
probably won't change anything but I just want you to know that I
am really concerned because I have a water issue already and
now I am really going to have to worry about it.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Ms. St. Jean. We appreciate your comments and we
will take them into consideration.
Ms. St. Jean: Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you. Anyone else wishing to speak on this item? Good
eveningI sir.
Joe Halley, 15341 Foch, Livonia, MI. Been there for 25 years. Did this probably
20 years ago for the same thing and it ended up just being what
we see now. There is nothing built there. Tore down all the trees.
It is kind of a debacle. Anyway, I am against the project. I don't
like the concept of having tall buildings looking down in our yards.
I don't want people looking in my yard. We are getting ready to
add on to our house and it is like you know do we want to do this?
We found out about the gun range just by chance with Clark &
Fron. My wife called the owner because she hadn't seen him
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30323
around and he is like... he sold it and it is going to be a gun shop.
We went down and talked to the guy who owns the property and
he said it is zoned... he can have a gun range also. He is trying
to buy the property of the mental health building right next door
directly to the east. So, we got...that is just jacked up. That being
said, a week ago we had a meeting and we spoke to Mr. Bazzi,
several of us after the meeting and he stated that... we told him
that we didn't want it and he said he would be willing to eliminate
the pool like you said, the clubhouse, what the heck else ... what
eIse ... just the increased traffic on our street. It is a residential
street. We got a lot of kids. My property value is going to go
down, that is pretty much what I got to say.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Haftey. We appreciate that. Anyone else wishing
to come forward? Good evening, sir.
'John Dmytro, 15410 Foch, Livonia, MI. Just to start, I am 100% against this
proposal. I don't think there is a single person that I have talked
to in the area that is for it. I mean I am realistic in the manner to
where I understand where anybody owning a piece of property
ought to have the rights to make income on it and not just have it
sit and pay taxes on it that is not earning them an income. I also
feel that it is not fair to the residents when they purchase a home,
they take into factor the surrounding area as part of the biggest
decisions as to why they would want to live there and particularly
in my scenario when I walk out to one of the biggest selling pieces
to me is when I look out my back window of my bedroom and I
am about 10-15 feet from my back fence which is that little square
of woods, which is nice ... we get a lot of deer, we get turkey and
lot of wild birds, you know, overall just wildlife that live in the
woods. So, as you can imagine you know being presented with
this situation to where you know suddenly you are going to go
from quite the opposite of a serene setting of having all the wildlife
behind you and woods to you know like I said, the opposite of that
and having multi -story apartments including pools and
clubhouses and you know I think it is a 48 additional parking
spots. I think we can all agree or I am going to agree that 1 100%
would not have bought that property if that was the case. Now
again, I also take into the mind you know it is a business too. The
City of Livonia will ultimately get more revenue from that property
through more people paying taxes and so will the owner, so I am
not naive to think that there is an opportunity for something to be
done, but you know it is just a real crappy spot to do it. Like
literally between two people's yards is just crazy to me. Like he
said, there is obviously a lot of real estate in Detroit and other less
admirable spots, but not so much just necessarily like the city, but
even everywhere. It is like if you see a patch of woods, it is like
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snap your fingers we just have to make sure we take it all down
and put something up there just to get rid of any single shred of
wildlife around us. It is honestly kind of sickening that they do
that. Even more so it is not only that we are going to shred any
little spot of woods we have left in the area, but we are going to
put it right smack dab in the back between two people's
backyards. I mean I think that is inappropriate place that you
want to put something like that, especially with how dense this lot
size is. Because of the lot size and the proposal at hand, it is
absolutely necessary per their plans that these buildings and
there is going to be a lot of traffic just a couple feet from our
property lines based on the proposal. It isn't even like we got a
big spot but we can put it more so in the middle or one direction
away from other peoples yards. I will inevitably have a lot on
engagement with the people that are going to be a part of that
property right there, so I don't think anybody can sit here and say
boy I wish instead of looking at this nice patch of woods and
wildlife that I have, a multi -story and 48 parking spots and a pool
and the whole nine -yards, literally just a couple feet from there
property line. If I met somebody that said that, that would be
really weird. Also, I ... the kind of people that live in apartments
and I certainly don't want to paint with a broad brush, but I was
one of those people. Statistically those are the younger
generation who don't have the financial well-being to be a
homeowner yet, or established or where they have a big enough
family and things like that, and for a lack of better terms I used to
be that person when I was younger living in apartments. I was a
wild animal and so was 99% of the people living in these
apartments and I can just tell you there was a lot of domestic
disputes with a lot of other people. You see cops all the time and
you see a lot of interactions with people that you wouldn't
normally see at a normal quiet neighborhood like we have
currently. Additionally, so again to go from wildlife being gone to
now having upwards to 48 cars with 48 people assigned to those
in a real small area and like someone mentioned and I didn't even
think about this is that our road is a bus route and it doesn't even
have any sidewalks to it, so any overflow and as much as we
could agree that that parking could or couldn't be ample for that
but when people have parties and get together's, whatever the
case is, inevitably there is going to be overflow of cars that need
to park somewhere. Where is that overflow going to go? It is
going to go on our residential street, particulary obviously
because I am literally the third house off the corner I have small
children and we don't even have sidewalks, so whenever we are
walking down the street you can imagine having people park
there and it creates somewhat of a safety hazard by anywhere
you can minimize that is ideal of course.
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30325
Mr. Wilshaw: Mr. Dmytro, would it be safe to assume that if you were given a
choice you would prefer a single family residential or perhaps a
condominium property there instead of the apartments? Is that
what I am hearing from you?
Mr. Dmytro: Yes. I would...) particularly don't like the aspect of being people
like Joe mentioned of multi -story to where... most of our houses
are one-story so they could look down especially being so close
and literally looking at my window seeing people on their balcony
or whatever the case is looking down directly into my yard. Even
having a privacy fence won't alleviate that situation. Obviously, if
there was any kind of development a privacy fence is going to be
necessary. Pretty much required and having it multi -level is ... a
privacy fence... there is nothing you can do essentially to have
any kind of privacy in your back yard whatsoever. Again, I think
I made my point clear I obviously...I am including everybody
around me...I don't think it is appropriate to move forward with
that and we really would like that retracted. Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Definitely. Thank you. We appreciate your comments. Anyone
else wising to make any comments?
Joanne Davis, 15852 Foch, Livonia, MI. I live there with my husband. He has
been there between 25 and 30 years. I would like to ask a
question. I think like we are on trial. Mr. Ventura, you brought to
Mr. Long's attention the fact that the sign was supposed to be
posted to let everyone driving down Five Mile know that there was
a rezoning issue. Why was that not put into effect? Why was it
not put into force?
Mr. Wilshaw: I can answer the question for you Ms. Davis. That is a
requirement that the petitioner has and when he has an
opportunity to come back up here and speak, if he wants to
address this in more detail he can, but I will say is that because
of the fact that the sign was not posted, which is required, that is
a factor that we are going to ... that comes into our decision -
making process. So, needless to say, we are aware that it wasn't
done, and it will be addressed because of that.
As.
Davis: Is it supposed to be done?
Mr. Wilshaw: Yes, ma'am.
As,
Davis: So, it wasn't though?
Or.
Wilshaw: Correct.
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S. Davis: So, the citizens that drive in Livonia have been denied the
information necessary to their wellbeing.
Mr. Wilshaw: It is one of two ways we try to notify citizens. Of course, the
immediate residents receive a notification that is mailed to them.
We also post this agenda is our newspaper and our internet and
so one, so there is a public posting, but the sign itself is an
important public notice to anyone that lives in the area or drives
by that area that a rezoning is being planned for that site. That is
why we have that sign requirement.
Ms. Davis: I wish it would be put into place. I wish that everything would be
halted and put on temporary hold until that requirement and
others that I have heard have been fulfilled. That is we can do this
or we can do that... no, that is our lives.
Mr. Wilshaw: You are correct.
Ms. Davis: That is our lives. If they were doing it in your neighborhood and
you lived on our street, you would be here too.
Mr. Wilshaw: Correct. That is one of
the decisions
that
we can make tonight.
We could table this item
and put it on
hold,
or we could vote on it
today.
Ms. Davis: I hope in good conscience that you treat us as you do those that
you love.
Mr. Wilshaw: Definitely.
Ms. Davis: Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, ma'am. Good evening, ma'am.
Nicole Nowak, 15455 Green Lane, Livonia, MI. I wrote what I wanted to say
because I didn't want to forget. I am sorry. I am going to be kind
of reading it. Bear with me.
Or.
Wilshaw: That is fine.
Ms. Nowak: First, I want to say I am against this plan. When I first got married
to my husband, we lived in a condo and we lived apartments, we
lived near mobile homes, and when we decided that we wanted
to start a family, we wanted to move to a home. We wanted a
neighborhood. We wanted a peaceful safe quiet space to raise
our family. We love Livonia. We are so happy we found a home
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here and with that home we found some safety, that sense of
quiet, that sense of community. I really feel that this plan and
adding this much density to the population that is already here
between our houses, as everyone said, really... it takes away all
those things that I love about Livonia. They mentioned the
dumpsters, the noise, lights, traffic, the overflow of parking on our
streets, that loss of privacy with those being taller than every
other home that is there. I am just really feeling that I am losing
my sense of safety, my sense of quiet, my sense of community,
and my neighborhood. All these things that are important to me
as I raise my family in the city. Just this past Monday morning, I
have a two-year old daughter, and we were eating breakfast and
we spent the entire time watching four deer play outside in the
backyard. If this plan goes through as proposed and removing
these woods, mornings like that are gone forever. That makes
me really sad.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Ms. Nowak. Appreciate your comments. Good
evening, sir.
Jason Nowak, 15455 Green Lane, Livonia, MI. I didn't write down my things so I
will be a bit more rambling than my wife was. First off, Mr. Bazzi,
I am sorry to hear about your father. I hope he does have a fast
recovery and I am also very encouraged to hear you mentioned
the topics we brought up with you the other day. I think, as my
wife mentioned, one of our bigger points are those woods. Those
woods are nice there. They do bring wildlife. It leaves a buffer
zone. I think...I am opposed to it, but at the same time that you
purchased that property, and I would like to work with you on
building what could be amendable for all of us or what could work
for all of us. I know the density of what you are proposing seems
intense, the size, the scale. Just with it being over two -stories as
we have all mentioned, the majority of our homes are one-story,
so the idea of going over two stories does seem to impose a lot
into our houses and into our yards and things like that. Just
some ... to add on to what my wife was saying. Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Nowak. Anyone else wishing to make
comments? Please come forward.
Mr. Czerwinski: I heard that who makes this final decision is City Council, right?
Mr. Wilshaw: Correct,
Mr, Czerwinski: Now, has it ever happened that outside contractors do contribute
to Council members campaign funds?
January 11, 2022
30328
Mr. Wilshaw: I can't speak to that, sir. I don't know.
Mr. Czerwinski: I know it has happened in the past and I am afraid a donation
from an outside contractor to a campaign could change their
minds.
Mr. Wilshaw: I understand that question. That is a question that you can ask
them.
Mr. Czerwinski: That's all I have to say.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you. Good evening, sir.
Kenneth Petty, 15331 Foch, Livonia, MI. Basically, the first house when you turn
in. The big, tall one behind the beauty salon there. My wife and
I are opposed to such a large building being put up. We do have
three children. Two small children and one 18-year-old. Ourtwo-
smalls do like to ride their bikes up to the gas station and we do
have a nice view to watch them make the trip and back. So, I
know that may go away regardless of if a smaller building goes in
or anything like that nature, but the idea of a large development
coming in increases to us the threat that there is a lot more
unknown variables coming into the community that a smaller
development could possibly diminish. You are introducing so
many more families, so much more influx of tenancy who don't
really have that permanence that our community carries with it.
We also feel that it could possible, depending on the scale of this,
I couldn't exactly hear how many units or how many families are
anticipated in the units, so 12 units. What influx would that be to
the educational system and the community with tenancy? I
wouldn't expect them to have the same values to reinforce
community and equity into the community. I apologize. I got a
little off track. From our experience, we came from Redford
Township about four years ago, and in that time, renting was just
skyrocketing.in the neighborhood. We were one of the few actual
homeowners left in the community and we had joined the parent
club in the neighborhood because we wanted to contribute. In
that environment you see such a small parent participation
because they don't have the equity in the community. They aren't
investing their additional time or maybe they don't have the time
to invest in their student's afterschool activities and school
endeavors. I wouldn't want a huge influx of extra kids saturating
the educational experience for children. So, that is something
that kind of concerns me, because they would all be in our school
district and in our schools that our students attend. On top of that,
just like everybody has been saying, there is this fear of reduced
property values. We have been working very hard on maintaining
January 11, 2022
30329
our home and building equity in our home. We have plans to let
our neighbors build on to our existing property and increase our
equity. We feel that something like this of this nature would
diminish that as well as property taxes because you are reducing
the values of the homes in the area around this large
development. So, that being said, if we could... oh, and on top of
that, we do have a large, as everyone has been stating, a large
amount of water comes in our area. It feeds into the local river
there and everything drains through that back area. If that is not
available for water to soak into, it is going to go into everyone
eIse's yards, possibly more into our yard. We already have heavy
saturation from the heavy rain that gets into our garage. We
wouldn't want more coming back into our property. If we can
prevent that. That being said we could negotiate on something
smaller. Single-family homes, small condos, less parking
spaces, more natural scenery, more of what community is built
around. I think that would be a much more reasonable request
and I think that would be a much easier impact for us to absorb,
as well as our school system and the transportation involved with
that and all the possible traffic that could come with such a big
facility.
Mr. Wilshaw: Excellent. Thank you, Mr. Petty. Appreciate your comments.
There is one lady coming forward. Good evening, ma'am.
Alex Cleveland, 15433 Green Lane, Livonia, MI. In fact, I have been in the
neighborhood so long I know all the original owners of these
homeowners. I am just going to repeat a lot of what everybody
has said that I am concerned about. Basically, two streets of
single-family homes. Our backyards back up to each other, but
we have that wooded area between us. There is that empty land
that is closer to Five Mile that doesn't really impose on us. Again,
the flooding is bad on Foch, but it is even worse on Green Lane.
I could show you pictures of it. It isn't just after a rain; it is like
right now. I can't walk into my backyard without wearing boots.
We are concerned about the dumpsters, the two -stories, we are
all single -story families. Parking along our fences, which is what
the proposal shows. I raised my children in this home and in this
backyard and I can't imagine them playing and having cars
parking and the parking would go this way facing our fence. I
just...I think that the one thing that I want to impart on you is that
whatever decision you make, you will be able to go home to your
home and we will have to live with the consequences forever,
however long you live there. So, it will change our lives and our
home. Having grown up in Livonia, a mile away from where I live
now... my older son lives in the house that I grew up in. It has
always been Livonia is a safe, quiet, wonderful place to raise your
January 11, 2022
30330
kids, because my son has a great education here. It has been
wonderful, but things will change, and they won't change for the
better for us. Just keep that in mind and good luck.
Mr. Wilshaw: an you, Ms. Cleveland. One more gentleman coming forward
here. Good evening, sir.
Jeff Douglass, 15445 Green Lane, Livonia, MI. Hello. Hopefully the last, I know.
We are kind of regurgitating all the same things. I did want to
start off with it will be a negative impact on our property value.
It's the biggest reason why I am against this. I moved into my
house with my wife six years ago. A forever resident of Westland,
but I have grown up in Livonia school system. All my friends lived
in Livonia. I have been part of the community my entire life, so
going on 34 years. Livonia has always been a safe place. That
is one of the reasons my wife and I decided when we purchased
our house that we wanted to start a family. We went through
numerous houses, and we finally found something that we felt
was going to give us that opportunity to create a life, create a
family, and grow within a residence. So, a decrease in our
property value is going to monetarily impact us. The next thing is
the backflow of water and the retention of water in our yards. So,
I spent close to $15,000 trying to solve the standing water in my
back yard. At one point we had tens of thousands of tadpoles
that just came bred in our yard. I was driving over them in the
morning when I backed out of my garage and I was driving over
them at night when I pulled my car into my garage, not to mention
the amount noise that the tadpoles make is astounding. All night
they are going. It is worse than crickets. So, I have spent over
$15,000 and I have spent countless hours of my own time trying
to solve and fix this problem. The problem still hasn't been fixed.
I actually had contractors that will not take on my job quoting me
upwards of $30,000 to solve this water issue. They cannot
guarantee a solve. When I originally started this endeavor, I
contacted the city about the water issue. One of the things that I
was told is hey you know what, it sucks you are kind of screwed
and your stuck with it unless you want to put in all the time, energy
and money into getting it resolved. Part of this is because when
the subdivision was designed back in the 50's and 60's, there was
a natural easement for both the people on Foch and the people
on Green Lane in the back of our lots, so that would be for me the
west end of my property line. That, the natural easement, flows
south towards Five Mile and that is where the water is supposed
to exit. That is where it is supposed to be picked up in the storm
drain. However, due to a change in topography over time, and
this was a sub that the city had informed me that it really isn't their
fault, it really isn't anybody else's fault, it is just how it is. It is
January 11, 2022
30331
geography. It is topography. Over time my house has become
one of the lowest points in all of the neighbors surrounding me.
Currently, my neighbor that was just up here, she has a bunch of
ice in her backyard. I have over eight inches of ice frozen in the
backyard. Ice will not melt and not dry and absorb into the ground
until close to 4ch of July. Historically that is just how it has always
been. Walking... we walk numerous times throughout the week.
We look into the neighbor's backyard and there is constantly
water in the back of all of our properties. This is going to be
something ... and again, from a monetary standpoint, will impact
us. If they are going to do any sort of construction, that is not
going to address the issue with where my water should flow going
south towards that property being developed. Again, not
necessarily because this changes topography over time and you
know it could have been poor city planning, something that the
engineers didn't know about then. However, this will cause a
backflow of water, even more water to accumulate in my
backyard. That is also a health risk. The amount of stench, the
amount of mosquitos, the amount of bacteria, the amount of
viruses that grow within that standing water, that stagnant
standing water, creates a health issue for myself, my neighbors,
and the animals around. We have a lot of squirrels, a lot of deer.
We even have groundhogs that come into our water drinking the
water. So, that is an issue of health as well. Another thing that
we can look at as an issue of health is with the increased units
coming in, waste disposal. So, we already have an issue with
rats and mice that come into our yard. I have rats that try to get
into my garage. I have to keep my garage closed at all times
because the colder weather comes, and the rats start looking for
warm places. Bringing these units in is going to increase that
amount of rodent infestation, both rats and mice, to the area.
Another thing to consider is the safety. Whether it is apartments,
whether it is condos, unless these people coming in area going
to be purchasing and being a stake of their own into whatever is
being developed, these people will not have a stake like the rest
of the property owners surrounding the development will have. I
take pride in my property. My neighbors commend me on how I
keep my property up. The way that I keep my property us brings
me business as a small business owner by people looking at my
property and saying hey, I want you to do work for me. These
people coming in will not have that same stake. They will not
keep up with the area around them like a property owner or like
us that live in the area and have created the community around
that area will. Another thing to look at from a safety standpoint is
when you are bringing in these people that don't have any stake,
they don't care as much. You get that riff raff. I don't want to
stereotype any sort of demographics that will come in, so I will
January 11, 2022
30332
say again, that these people who do not have a stake like we do.
They will bring in riff raff. Statistically speaking, crime will
increase and two of my good friends are police officers. They
reside in the City of Livonia as well. An exit for a criminal is going
to be a dark place that they cannot be easily followed by a vehicle.
What does that look like? That looks like our backyards. So,
whether it is broad daylight, whether it is the middle of the night,
we have that increased risk that somebody is going to be running
through our back yards trying to evade police because of some
crime that has been committed because it is the easiest getaway.
From a safety standpoint, as well, I have two young children. I
have a one -year -old and a three-year old. I also, in addition to
the money that I spent and the time I spent trying to fix the water
in my backyard, I also spent about $1000 in privacy bushes so
that people wouldn't be able to see my son or daughter playing
around in their bathing sui in the summer as they are coming up
the street because it is exposed from the street to see into my
backyard. Therefore, I put privacy bushes up to eliminate that
coming from the streets, so that my kids, my wife would feel more
secure, more safe at home. That will be eliminated by bringing in
eventually multi -story units that we will lose the privacy. Now, my
wife isn't going to feel comfortable taking my son and daughter
out to play in a splashpad in the back of our yard during the
summer months because we are going to have people getting in
and out of our cars not even 100 feet away. Away from the loss
of privacy, another thing we can look at is why we got into this
neighborhood. We got into this neighborhood because I look out
my back window and I don't feel like I am in the middle of the city.
I feel like I am in real nice rural area. My neighbors have large
properties that I don't feel that I am on top of their house. I look
out and see deer. My daughter and my son jump up and down.
Deer daddy, deer. We walk out there and there is a 12-point buck
in our backyard that we were able to stand 15-fee away from. We
feed them. We have squirrels that come up and we feed them
peanuts on a daily basis. We have a vast amount of birds that
come into the area. You know this is something that you can look
at as a potential safety issue, because the next place for them to
run to is Five Mile. However, the herd of deer go from the
southern most part of the properties between Green Lane and
Foch where the tree line is going up to where the property
developed ends and the deer migrate north to the creek. This is
something that hey if we don't want to misplace animals, then we
need to at least keep the tree line in their because this is where
they have been most nights. We watch them at night, and we
watch them when we wake up in the morning. The ambience of
why we moved in is a big reason. That is why we wanted to move
there. I go out at night and other than a couple of lights on the
January 11, 2022
30333
back of my neighbor's houses, I don't see anything other than
stars. We don't have streetlights on either side of our streets, so
again with the development coming in, that would bring in light
and noise and is going to disrupt the ambience. Again, if I were
to sell, that is going to deter future buyers because of people not
wanting to be next to a large development like that. Then lastly,
you know we cannot just assume that the property doesn't have
the same rate as we do as property owners we developed. We
are just asking for some compromise. This is ... and you can see
that we have a strong community presence about how we feel
about the area we live in. We have a lot of legacy. We have a
lot of new coming in here to start families. That was why I moved
in with my wife. Looking that going forward with the development,
we would be open to something that would be single -story,
something that offered its tenants opportunities at permanent
residency, so then that would incorporate their stake into the area
around them. Helping rebuild the community morale. If this does
get developed. Then keeping the area of trees as a buffer zone.
So, that way we night not get as impacted. Me personally, where
my property is located. I can't speak for the others south of me
because they won't have that buffer of trees. So, in lieu of that, if
something is developed, perhaps a hedge or berm. Something
that brings privacy. Then more than anything, the issue of water.
So, if something is developed there, the issue of water needs to
come into play so that it will positively impact all the residents that
are north of the property.
Mr. Wilshaw: Just so you are aware, Mr. Douglass, because you did address
the issue of water and the fact that this was an area that was
developed quite a long time ago, and you are correct in that the
standards have changed in terms of water management. There
is ... the County requires much more engineering and work put
into water management when properties are developed than they
ever have in the past. This development, if it is developed in any
way, whether it is one-story single-family homes or apartments or
condominiums, or whatever is proposed, water management
making sure the water on that property stays on that property is
controlled into the sewer system will definitely be a part of the
process through the engineering. That will be addressed. Just
to give you at least some comfort. That is not going to be
forgotten about.
Or.
Douglass: Okay.
Or.
Wilshaw: Because that is very important to you, obviously, and it is to us.
January 11, 2022
30334
Mr. Douglass: More than anything because I have almost a quarter of an acre
of property, and I can't use majority of that backyard until the
middle of summer.
Mr. Wilshaw: It seem counterintuitive sometimes when you have an open piece
of property like this, that when you develop on it that a lot of
people think that the water is just going to shed away from there
and go into everyone else's property. The reality is that when you
have an open field, there is no water management in that field
right now, other than it is soaking into the ground. If you have
heavy clay the water is just going to shed to the neighboring
properties. When you do develop it, at least the elements such
as roofs, and downspouts and eaves troughs and catch basins
and all of those things are put into the development to control that
water and direct it into the sewer system. It actually often
improves the water quality or the water drainage in that area.
Mr. Douglass: I can understand that. It is from my perspective and from the
education that I have been able to gain over the past six years of
dealing with this issue is that the property that is set to be
developed does sit higher topographically than my property. So,
from a topographical standpoint, we would have to do something
that would bring in a drain across the back of our properties
extending further north than the development. You know? The
lines or the borders sit...
Mr. Wilshaw: That is all factored in when it is engineered. Just so you know, it
isn't something that we are going to... it will be dealt with at some
point. When this property is developed. We appreciate your
comments, Mr. Douglass. Good evening, sir.
Paul Dewyse, 15491 Foch, Livonia, Mil. I just wanted to bring up one...l agree
with everything everyone is saying here, but one thing for
me ... my house sits on two lots on Foch Street, so we have just
under an acre and what it seems like to me is what we are trying
to do here is put so much stuff into one small area. If you drive
by that area, I can't imagine that many parking spots and two big
buildings and a pool, and a clubhouse. That would be like putting
it all in my backyard. I just can't believe it. It is like taking a 1,000
square foot house and putting six bedrooms in it. To me. That is
what it seems like. My recommendation is to try find a way to put
a few houses in there or some low condos or something, again
where people have owner stake because we all know...I like
John, lived in apartments when I was young and crazy at one
point and stuff happens. Apartments bring in transient people. I
don't care what you say, that is what happens. That is what we
will have in our neighborhood. I have been there over 20 years
January 11, 2022
30335
and raised three daughters in
a great,
quiet,
very nice
neighborhood. I think we are being
invaded on.
That's
it.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Dewyse.
(inaudible from audience)
(Unknown person) The
lady
brought up about the sign
... there is supposed to be a
sign on
the
property for the proposal
for the rezoning?
Mr. Wilshaw: Correct.
(Unknown person) Was the owner of the property notified that this sign was
supposed to be up?
Mr. Wilshaw: We are going to talk about that in just a little bit with the property
owner.
(Unknown person) Oh, because my assumption and I don't know if this is true.
That is why I asked that question. If he was notified that he was
supposed to put up the sign and he still hasn't taken action to do
that, I think that is just the very minimal of an ask from the City
Council and due diligence and a sign of respect at a bare
minimum to the residents in that neighborhood. If he can't even
do something like that, I think that is very telling of the character
that we are dealing with. Something as simple as that to try pull
teeth to get done let alone conversations ever had that he is
willing to work with and to be flexible with things. Anybody can
say anything they want, but once they get approval to do
something, all those good intentions can go, obviously, right out
the window.
Mr. Wilshaw: I understand. That is something that I believe was a
misunderstanding. We will get that cleared up. Thank you very
much. There is one more gentleman wishing to speak, so we will
give him the last word here.
Steven Bernardy, 15809 Foch, Livonia, MI. I raised my son there. It was a nice
neighborhood to raise my son. You walk up and down these
streets, walking your dog...I walk my dogs up and down these
streets and it is a quiet neighborhood. My neighbors are my
friends. I have helped my neighbors with all kinds of projects over
the years. They have helped me with my projects. I put probably
upwards of $100,000 into my property since I moved in into home
improvements. I spent probably, in the last three years, $12,000
in fencing. The one thing in that neighborhood has in common is
that they are homeowners. I think a gentleman a few minutes
January 11, 2022
30336
ago talk about the stake we all have in that neighborhood. We
do. The difference with this proposal is that you are going to have
transients coming in and out of there. Here today, gone tomorrow
who don't have a stake in that neighborhood. I personally
couldn't care less who lives next door to me in any way, but I
would like to feel that they were ... they had ownership in the
neighborhood and that they cared about what is going on. By
nature, people who are coming in temporarily do not have that
kind of concern about the neighborhood. Now just in this last
year, we have had... there is a commercial building at the end of
the street at Five and Foch. It was a real estate office. They
moved out and I know what is coming in. It is going to be a gun
shop. That is not something that I am crazy about either, but I
don't it to keep going down the slide from there and you know
whether whatever is developed on that land is one -family housing
or even professional office like a dentist, or maybe a law office,
something like that, that would be fine. I have no problem with
that. What is proposed here, is not in keeping with what has been
there for years. It is going to affect every homeowner in that area.
I know you guys are probably all Livonia residents?
Mr. Wilshaw: Yes.
Mr. Bernardy: I don't know where you live but if you weren't sitting up there and
you lived in our neighborhood, I would imagine you would be
sitting out here right now. Voicing the same concerns that we
are. I hope you keep that in mind when you make your decision.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you. Mr. Bazzi, did you want to come back up? We always
like to give the petitioner an opportunity to address any concerns
that were heard. Again, we are not going to get into a back -and -
forth debate, but if there is any particular comments you wanted
to address or anything else you would like to say to us, you can
do that. Please speak to us though.
Mr. Bazzi: I want to say I understand and appreciate all of your concerns.
Everybody's concerns. I wouldn't want nobody coming into my
neighborhood and just invading and doing what they want. I
would want it to stay a safe neighborhood. I think we have a little
bit of a misunderstanding. The only reason we are changing from
NMI to NM2 is because we are trying to put a garage... these are
1,800 square foot condominiums. They range anywhere from
$250,000 to $350,000. They are owned. They are not
apartments. The only reason we are changing it from NMI to
NM2 is so we can have an extra'/2 story. NMI is only allowed
two stories. We are not going to own these condominiums. They
are going to be owned by people. We don't want to keep any of
January 11, 2022
30337
the real estate. In regard to the dumpsters and whatnot, we will
make sure that it is under control. The forest in the back ... I
understand what you guys are saying. I would want it to stay the
same way. We are more than willing to clean it up and keep it
the same way, but we just want to clean it up. It doesn't look good
the way it is. The water...I have nothing... that is not in my control.
That is in the city's control. Like I said, I would love to
accommodate to anything and everything they want because it is
where they live. I am willing to accommodate to how they are
living to keep it that way. Anything that is in my hands, I am willing
to do. In regard to the water, that condition, I have nothing to do
with that. These are condominiums. These are 1,800 square foo
condominiums. They are not apartments. Every condo is
separate. They are connecting. There are six condos connected
and six condos connected. There is 12 units. In regard to the
parking, whatever the city says... how many parking spots we
need... if they say 36 then I would be more than happy to put the
rest as landscaping and make it look nice. That is how much
property we have. We wanted to fill out the property. That is all
I have to say and I appreciate everyone's comments.
Mr. Wilshaw: Mr. Bazzi, stay up here in case there are any additional questions
from any of our commissioners. I do appreciate you clarifying the
use of apartments versus condominiums. That is something that
even in our notes has been somewhat unclear as to what the
intent was. That is helpful, not only to us, but to the residents. Is
there any questions from any of our commissioners for our
petitioner?
Mr. Long: Mr. Bazzi...
(inaudible from audience)
Mr. Wilshaw: Sir, this is
all going to
be put into a record. It is a public record.
Everything
being said
tonight
is being... is going to be written
down and
will passed
along to
City Council based on whatever
decision is
being
made. It is
in
writing.
Mr. Long: Thank you. I know Mr. Ventura brought this up earlier, but I need
to understand. The renderings of what we are looking at show
three distinct floor plans, which would indicate three stories. You
keep saying two and a half stories. So, explain to me how far
down ... that is the front side and the garage would accessible
from the back side. How far down are you digging into the
ground?
January 11, 2022
30338
Or. Bazzi: I wouldn't know. My architect would have to tell you exactly now
that would go. I am not familiar with how far down and how far
up...I do know you pull up to this a building... you pull up from the
back. You go into your condo and you go three steps up and you
are in your living room and you go three steps up and you are in
your dining room, kitchen, and bedrooms. It is two -stories, but it
is two and a half stories, I am sorry. The only reason we changed
it from a NMI to an NM2 is NMI allows only two stories. That is
the only reason we are rezoning into an NM2 and each condo will
be worth anywhere from $250, 000 to $350,000, so in regard to
your house and the value of the house I don't that it should be...
Mr. Long: Mr. Bazzi, let me cut you off because I understand that and I
applaud you for making that point that it is a condominium and I
think that is important. I know you have been put into a spot
where you are kind of pitch hitting, however, that is kind of
important information that I need. Without the ability to answer
my questions and... it is...I can't support something that
doesn't... that I can't understand. So, that is fine. Mr. Chairman,
I will yield my time. Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Long. Again, just to note for everyone's benefit,
we are looking at the zoning of the property tonight. The stie plan
has been presented and these renderings and such are
something that would be discussed and addressed and a very
detailed process which would happen after the zoning would take
place. It is not to say that this is going to be the final product or
what exactly is going to be on this site. Any other questions from
any of our commissioners for our petitioner? If not...
Mr. Bazzi: I would like to say one more thing.
Mr. Wilshaw: Go ahead, Mr. Bazzi.
Mr. Bazzi: Regarding the sign...) have done this twice before in other cities.
I paid the fee and in other cities they put up the sign. I found out
today from the...I got a call and an email today that the sign was
not put up. I called the architect I told him were we supposed to
put up the sign and he is like I thought the city was supposed to.
It was a full misunderstanding. If I knew we were supposed to
put up the sign, that would have been put up. I think it is 15 days
before the meeting right?
Mr. Wilshaw: Correct.
Mr. Bazzi: I would have done that. I was not notified that we were
responsible for the sign.
January 11, 2022
30339
Mr. Wilshaw: Right, so it was a misunderstanding as to whose role it was to do
that. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Caramagno: Mr. Bazzi, you said you did two other projects?
Mr. Bazzi: Yes.
Mr. Caramagno: Tell me where they are at.
Mr. Bazzi: One is in Dearborn.
Mr. Caramagno: Give me the address.
Mr. Bazzi: 7430 Greenfield, Dearborn and the other project we are working
on is 2011 Evangeline.
Mr. Caramagno: Evangeline?
Mr. Bazzi: Yes. Dearborn Heights 48127
Mr. Caramagno: The first one is in Dearborn and the second one is in Dearborn
Heights?
Mr. Bazzi: 2011 Evangeline. It is a house actually that we are demoing and
putting three houses on three parcels.
Mr. Caramagno: Mr. Bazzi, the first one is in Dearborn, the second one is in
Dearborn Heights?
Mr. Bazzi: Yes
Mr. Caramagno: Thank you.
Mr. Bazzi: Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Caramagno. If there are no more questions for
our petitioner, we will close the public hearing at this time and a
motion would be in order.
On a motion by Caramagno, seconded by Ventura, and unanimously adopted, it
was
#01-01-2022 RESOLVED, That pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held
by the City Planning Commission on January 11, 2022, on
Petition 2021-10-01-07 submitted by Kassem Bazzi, pursuant to
Sections 13.13 and 13.15 of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning
January 11, 2022
30340
Ordinance, requesting to rezone the property at 27480 Five Mile
Road, located on the north side of Five Mile Road between
Inkster Road and Foch Avenue in the Southeast'/4 of Section 13,
from NMI, Neighborhood Multifamily to NM2, Neighborhood
Multifamily — Maximum 4 Stories, the Planning Commission does
hereby deny Petition 2021-10-01-07 for the following reasons:
1. That the Petitioner has failed to affirmatively show that the
proposed change of zoning to NM2, Multifamily Residential
and the intended design and layout of the development as
presented to the Planning Commission would be compatible
to and in harmony with the surrounding residential
neighborhoods.
2. That the plan to construct two (2) three-story apartment
buildings that exceed the maximum usable floor area as a
percentage of lot area is contrary to the goals and objectives
of the Zoning Ordinance which seeks to create multifamily
housing projects that are compatible with nearby single-
family development in terms of height, bulk and density.
3. That the proposed change of zoning is not needed to
develop the property.
4. That the proposed change of zoning is inconsistent with the
established pattern of development in the surrounding area
and would adversely alter the character of the
neighborhood, and
5. That the proposed zoning and use is contrary to the
purposes, goals and objectives of the Zoning Ordinance,
which seek to ensure compatibility and appropriateness of
uses so as to enhance property values and to create and
promote a more favorable environment for neighborhood
use and enjoyment.
6. That the petitioner has failed to erect a sign on the property
pursuant to Section 13.15(6) of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning
Ordinance informing the public of the proposed amendment
to the Zoning Map,
7. That any future proposal to rezone this property first requires
a recommendation by the Planning Commission after
holding a public hearing pursuant to Section 13.15.
January 11, 2022
30341
FURTHER RESOLVED, That notice of the above hearing was
given in accordance with the provisions of Section 13.13 of
Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance.
Mr. Wllshaw: Is there any discussion?
Mr. Wilshaw, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted. It will go on to City Council with an approving resolution.
ITEM #2 PETITION 2021-11-02-23 R & E Landscaping
Mr. Caramagno, Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda, Petition 2021-
11-02-23 submitted by R & E Landscaping and Construction,
L.L.C. requesting waiver use approval pursuant to Section 6.58
of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance to operate a special
trade contractors' yard at 34422 Rosati Avenue, located on the
west side of Stark Road just south of the CSX Railroad in the
Southwest /4 of Section 28.
Mr. Miller: The subject site is Lot 12 of the Rosati Industrial Park
Subdivision. The site is zoned M-1. Existing on the property at
this time is a 5,800 square foot building. They have parking along
the west side of the building. Behind the building is a 40 foot wide
asphalt paved area. One of the special requirements of a special
trade contractors yard is that, except for the front yard, the entire
lot should be fenced in. The petitioner is proposing to fence in
the parking lot and the paved area behind it with a six-foot high
chain link fence. The petitioner is proposing to store materials
related to the petitioners building construction projects.
Mr. Wilshaw: Is there correspondence for this item?
Mr. Miller: Yes. The first item is from the Engineering Division, dated
November 30, 2021, which reads as follows: "In accordance with
your request, the Engineering Division has reviewed the above
referenced petition. We have no objections to the proposed
waiver use at this time. The subject parcel is assigned the
address of #34422 Rosati Avenue. The existing parcel currently
has access to public water main, sanitary sewer and storm sewer
within the Rosati Avenue right-of-way. The developer will need to
meet current Engineering requirements for the proposed project,
including storm water detention per the latest version of the
Wayne County Storm Water Ordinance. It should be noted that
the parcel is within an area being investigated for soil and
groundwater contamination. As a result, the developer may be
required to provide special provisions under the slab of the new
January 11, 2022
30342
structure to protect against vapor intrusion or groundwater
interface. Final requirements will not be known until the
investigation has been completed, but until that time the
developer may want to contact the Michigan Department of
Environment, Great Lakes, and Energy (EGLE) for more details."
The letter is signed by David W. Lear, P.E., Assistant City
Engineer. The next letter is from the Livonia Fire & Rescue
Division, dated December 6, 2021, which reads as follows: "This
office has reviewed the site plan submitted in connection with a
request to construct a commercial building on property located at
the above referenced address. We have no objections to this
proposal with the following stipulations: Owner must provide a
Knox Box" (fire dept key box) for fire department after -hour
access to the building. Additionally, a key must be provided (in
the "Knox Box') for access to all fenced in areas as well." The
letter is signed by Greg Thomas, Fire Marshal. The next letter is
from the Division of Police, dated November 22, 2021, which
reads as follows: '7 have reviewed the plans in connection with
the petition. / have no objections to the proposal." The letter is
signed by Scott Sczepanski, Sergeant, Traffic Bureau. The next
letter is from the Inspection Department, dated January 3, 2022,
which reads as follows: "Pursuant to your request, the above -
referenced petition has been reviewed. This Department has no
objections to this petition. " The letter is signed by Jerome Hanna,
Director of Inspection. The next letter is from the Finance
Department, dated November 22, 2021, which reads as follows:
"1 have reviewed the addresses connected with the above noted
petition. As there are no outstanding amounts receivable, general
or water and sewer, / have no objections to the proposal." The
letter is signed by Connie Kumpula, Chief Accountant. The next
letter is from the Treasurer's Department, dated December 3,
2021, which reads as follows: `In accordance with your request,
the Treasurer's Office has reviewed the name and addresses
connected with the above noted petition. At this time taxes are
due, but not delinquent, therefore l have no objections to the
proposal." The letter is signed by Lynda Scheel, Treasurer. That
is the extent of the correspondence.
Mr. Wilshaw: Are there any questions for the planning staff? If not, our
petitioner...excuse me, Mr. Ventura.
Or.
Ventura: Mr. Miller, is this awaiver-use?
Or.
Miller: Yes, outside storage or special contractor's yard to store outside.
Or.
Ventura: So, this is a waiver -use?
January 11, 2022
30343
Mr. Miller: Yes,
Mr.
Ventura:
Thank
you.
Or.
Wilshaw:
Thank
you, Mr. Ventura.
Mr. Long?
Mr. Long: Given that items two and three are basically the same thing, are
we able to consolidate them ... take them together?
Or. Wilshaw: We are going to certainly have a much briefer presentation on the
second, excuse me, third agenda item, but they are two different
properties so we will have to have two separate votes.
Or. Long: I understand. Thank you.
Or. Wilshaw: Thank you. They are very similar, so it is not uncommon that
some of this discussion will bleed over on both of these. Any
other questions or comments? If not, our petitioner is here in the
audience. If you could start with your name and address for our
records.
Ron Emling, 34422 Rosati Ave., Livonia, MI, 48150. At this time it is pretty cut and
dry. We are just asking for a waiver to store outside building
materials while we ... I own the development, so I am the
developer. I bought it from Mr. Rosati about a year ago, so as we
build, and I explained this last week in the other meeting on
Tuesday, that we have excess materials. When you buy to do a
home or multiple homes, you buy in bulk. When you go to Costco
you buy in bulk, so we buy our materials in bulk so there is some
leftover until the next build gets started. Lot 2 that we are getting
ready to start on, we have left over materials getting ready to start
Lot 2. It is going to be the same size building and I was going to
suggest that if the board wasn't real fond of requesting the waiver
for Lot 12, where we are currently working out of, that we are
more desirable to get Lot 2 approved because Lot12 we believe
has been sold. Instead of burdening the city with that particular
situation and putting in the finances to put the fence up and gate
it and the Knox box for the Fire Department and all this other stuff,
that will let the new tenant deal with that and cross those roads if
it is sold and he wants to do that. We would be leaning more
today toward getting the approval for Lot 2 for the fenced in yard.
We were going to go and get a temporary construction easement
on Lot 10 and store our equipment there, but for now to kind of
avoid a bunch of extra red tape and going through the city and us
putting up the fence and moving out for six months knowing when
the next building is up ... our goal is to build the
buildings... unfortunately I am not blessed with millions of dollars
January 11, 2022
30344
for finance, so we are going to build one and get it on the market,
sell it and then move to the next building, get it on the market and
sell it and keep playing leapfrog until the building and the
development is completed. In the meantime, Lot 2 is going to be
more of our ... we are going to stay more permanent there and we
are going to need the outdoor storage more there than Lot 12 at
this time.
Mr. Wilshaw: Now, just for the commissioner's benefit, our map that we have
for this site has addresses on it. It doesn't have lot numbers on
it. Can you tell me what address you are looking or you are
saying you would prefer to keep this material on?
Mr. Emling: Right now we are using Lot 10. I don't have that address in my
head. I'm sorry, I wasn't prepared for that question. Lot 10...1
am in Lot 12, two lots to the west of Lot 12 is Lot 10. It is a vacant
lot. We are staging our equipment thereat this point. Our high
lifts and different outdoor equipment. Our scaffolding and
different things. Our block, pallets of block ... the only reason we
are asking for the indoor or the waiver for the fencing is because
we have fencing and piping and gates and stuff we store that we
don't want out there in the open. Someone can drive up when no
one is around and walk off with them and the pipes are very
expensive. As you know, metal is through the roof. So, we are
trying to keep our eyes and keep it close to our work area and
then the soft materials, like ceiling tiles, we store inside the
buildings.
Mr. Wilshaw: Okay. One second, Mr. Emling. Mr. Long, did you have...
Mr. Long: Mr. Chairman and Mr. Miller, if you put the page on after the
resolutions in the packet, that does have a map with various lots
so we can see what we are talking about here.
Mr. Wilshaw: What page in our packet?
Mr. Long: Page 59.
Or.
Miller: I don't have that in my slideshow.
Or.
Long: You did when you... right there...go back.
Or.
Miller: You mean right here?
Or.
Long: Right there. Your map is different than I have in my packet.
Or.
Wilshaw: I think it is the next proposal that has that...
January 11, 2022
30345
Mr. Long: Am I in the...
Mr. Wilshaw: You strayed into the next one.
Mr. Long: I am in item three, correct.
Mr. Miller: I think the address is the 34413.
Mr. Emling: There you go. That's it.
Mr. Wilshaw: Okay, so 34413 is Lot 2 and 34422 is Lot 12.
Mr. Emling: That is correct.
Mr. Wilshaw: We are looking currently on the map that is on Mr. Miller's screen
that says Lot 12. You are saying that you would prefer to keep
your items, if it is going to be on a single lot, on Lot 2, which is the
next petition that we have.
Mr. Emling: Yeah, I guess what I am saying is I am sure we qualify for outdoor
storage for both lots. If we wanted to and we come to an
agreement that we would waive the one on Lot 12 because I am
quite certain that the building is sold and we are going to start
focusing all of our efforts on Lot 2, that if I want to start spending
money on fencing and block and stuff and trying to secure stuff, I
would rather focus the efforts on Lot 12, especially at this time of
year. I can't put posts in the ground for any new fence and
couldn't do it until spring we will be moving out of there in the
spring, so this whole thing is kind of a moot point. There is no
point in pressing it when I don't think... and when we move out
then the city is going to be burdened with who is moving in and
what are they going to store outside. See? I don't to put that on
the city either, because we don't know what they are going to do
once it is fenced in and they are allowed to store stuff outside.
So, I say leave it clear and open Lot 12. Let's focus on Lot 2 and
I hate to say that I am kind of wasting your time right now with this
issue, that is why I am trying to streamline... get past it and see if
we could just put Lot 12 aside and kind of void it out, if you will.
We will focus on Lot 2 and get the waiver for Lot 2 and that might
be the best way to go.
Or.
Wilshaw: Understood, Like I said, these two petitions are very similar. The
discussion is obviously going to cross over to both of them. For
the benefit of the commissioners that were not at the study
meeting,...I think also, probably to reiterate what you are saying,
Mr. Emling, is that one of the concerns raised at our study
January 11, 2022
30346
meeting was you are essentially looking to leapfrog this
construction material from property to property as you develop.
The concern that we have is that, in doing so, that runs with the
land and stays with that property. Once you move out with your
construction activity and a tenant moves in, each tenant at each
of these sites would have the ability to have full construction or
outdoor trade contractor's yard with whatever material they
choose to put in and that is a concern we have.
Mr. Emling: Sure. I understand.
Mr. Wilshaw: So, if we can get you to narrow it down to one lot it would be more
preferable.
Mr. Emling: If you...l think you picked up part of what I was saying...that we
were going to leapfrog and in the continuance of that sentence I
said, just shortly ago, that we are going to be hanging in on Lot
2. That is what we are going to focus on in staying for the duration
of the...
Mr. Wilshaw: Keep it there...okay.
Mr. Emling: Yes. That is going to kind of be where we are going to home base
everything there. We want it off the tracks. I want to secure the
area for our small outdoor equipment and then we are going to
stay on 2 and then focus on doing the buildings. Some of the lots
have been sold since our last meeting, so things are moving
around and things are changing every day. If someone comes
up and offers us money to buy the rest of the lots, they will be
sold and I will be selling there and moving on to the next project.
Mr. Wilshaw: Understood.
Mr. Emling: While we are there we want to make sure that I don't do just what
you just said and put up a fence, I fight for it, I get it, and then I
move out of there and we don't know who is moving in there and
what they are going to put in there, so I don't want to put that on
the city.
Mr. Wilshaw: Exactly. Good. Let's see if there are any questions from any of
our commissioners and see what we can do for you?
Mr. Ventura: Mr. Chairman, to your comment, I recall that when we approved
the Excellerated Towing and Recovery site, which is right at the
western extreme end and this development we made it really
clear that there would be no outside storage and they agreed.
So, I am reluctant to approve any outside storage in this location,
January 11, 2022
30347
but I understand what Mr. Emling is saying. Is there a way to limit
the time he can do this or the duration of the construction of this
park? Not make it transferrable where he can sell the building
and to limit it to him only? If he sold the building, that the next
owner would then come forward if they wanted to have outside
storage and get it reapproved, are those things possible?
Mr. WIIShaw: That question did come up at the study meeting and Mr. Miller
can correct me if I am wrong, but my understanding is that this is
a waiver -use and waiver -uses run with the property, not the
petitioner, so we wouldn't be able to condition it for this user only.
Is that correct, Mr. Miller?
Mr. Miller: I think that is correct. I mean unless he agrees to it. I am trying
to remember if we have ever done that before. If he agrees and
part of the condition is ... that is kind of a Law Department
question, but that would be putting a condition on the waiver -use
which ... I don't know. I would think he would have to agree to that.
Mr. Emling: Can I speak for just a moment?
Mr. Wilshaw: Just one moment, Mr. Emling. Mr. Ventura?
Mr. Miller: With massage parlors, we have always said that if they move out
that the Council has to approve the new owner.
Mr. Ventura: That has been my experience and I thought why not something
similar here.
Mr. Miller: But, the outside storage...you are giving them the outside
storage...I don't know.
Mr. Ventura: I understand. I guess, Mr. Chairman, I look to the petitioner to
say... is this okay with you? We are trying to solve your problem
here for you.
Mr. Emling: When I spoke earlier and I started here and we go to what we
have to do anyway is that I just go notice of it today via email from
the Engineering Department, we have to go and get a temporary
construction easement. That is something kind of like what you
are speaking of. That is going to be for the use of Lot 10, just to
use it as a construction easement at this point and Lot 10, the
Excellerated Towing ... we are building that building as well, and I
thought I heard you say and I could be wrong, that there was no
outside storage allowed at Excellerated Towing, but he allowed
to park his vehicles there, right?
January 11, 2022
30348
Mr. Ventura: No. Not outside storage at all.
Mr. Emling: How do you run a tow yard without outside storage?
Mr. Ventura: No outside storage of vehicles there. I was specific.
Mr. Emling: I missed that. At the meeting... how is he going I a tow yard
or a tow company?
Mr. Ventura: He only brings...he
rarely
brings a vehicle there. Vehicles go
from where he
picks
them
up to another location.
Mr. Wilshaw: He doesn't use it as an impound yard or anything like that.
Mr. Emling: I will have to be sure he is aware of that because I understood
something completely different. That he was approved and we
have got excavating everything (inaudible)
Mr. Ventura: He is not approved for outside storage.
Mr. Emling: Okay, then we will have to get him back and let him know,
because from my understanding that it was all approved, but that
is a whole other subject, so let's stay focused here. The
temporary construction easement is where we will be doing our
staging and our outdoor stuff on Lot 10. We can move our piping
and stuff over there temporarily, tarp it or whatever we have to.
When the wind blows it off, it looks shotty. I don't like doing things
like that. I like to keep things a little bit more in control and
together. What you are asking is ... this is a three-year project at
least. So, I plan on being in that location three -years plus
because we don't have another spot, especially with this
economy going. I don't have another location where I want to
move my business to. So, I am going to stay there for...I am 60
now, I want to stay there until I am at least 66 so I can ready for
retirement. So, I am not going anywhere. If I get the waiver that
I am asking for, we are not leapfrogging and leaving that empty
and leaving to the next one in six -months from now. I am telling
you that is where I want to stay and that is why we are asking for
the waiver for Lot 2. Again, we keep jumping from Lot 12 to 2 so
we need to stay focused. I want to answer your questions from
Lot 12, but I am asking that we move past 12 and get into 2 so
we can focus on what I am really needing and it is a waiver for 2.
Or,
Ventura: Thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Mr. Long, did you have any comment you wanted to make?
January 11, 2022
30349
Mr. Long: Yeah, but I think a lot of it has been answered. So, this is Lot 12,
item #2 here, so should we table or deny #2 here and get into
item 3 so we can...
Mr. Wllshaw: So, what I have heard so far is, and I will leave this up to the
petitioner if he disagrees, but you are pretty much saying that you
are not interested in pursuing this contractor yard on Lot 12 at this
time?
Mr. Emling: That is correct.
Mr. Wilshaw: Which is the current petition before us, so it would seem
appropriate to me that we would resolve this one and move on to
the next one to make sure our comments are contributed to the
correct petition.
Mr. Miller: So, he is basically withdrawing this request.
Mr. Wilshaw: Exactly.
So, Mr. Miller, if
we...is
there a...if
he
is
going to
withdraw
his request, do we
need
to
formally
deny it
or
just...
Mr. Miller: I don't
think
so,
because
if
you formally deny
it, somebody else
could
come,
but
I think it
is
easiest to withdraw
it.
Mr. Wilshaw: Right. We have done that for other petitioners who have come
before us and changed their mind on something, so I think if there
is no objection from any of the other commissioners, through the
direction of the Chair we can withdraw item #2 on our agenda and
we will mark that off of our agenda for the time being. I don't hear
any objections from anybody, so we will do that. We will move
on to item #3.
ITEM #3 PETITION 2021-11-02-24 R & E Landscaping
Mr. Caramagno, Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda, Petition 2021-
11 02 24 submitted by R & E Landscaping and Construction,
L.L.C. requesting waiver use approval pursuant to Section 6,58
of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance to construct and
operate a special trade contractors' yard at 34413 Rosati Avenue,
located on the west side of Stark Road just south of the CSX
Railroad in the Southwest'/4 of Section 28.
Or.
Wilshaw: Mr. Miller, there is no additional information...) believe other than
the address, everything is the same.
January 11, 2022
30350
Or. Miller: The only thing is that this is new construction, the previous
building was existing. I can go into what is going to be
constructed. It is similar to what is Lot 12. 1 can go through it if
you want.
Mr. Wilshaw: You are more than welcome to. I think the only thing that is
important to note on this one is the fact that if this is location for
the special trade yard, that there would be landscape
requirements as well because of the adjacency to the residential.
Mr. Miller: Correct.
Mr. Wilshaw: Yeah, go ahead and let us hear.
Mr. Miller: This property is surrounded by industrial to the east, west, and
north. To the south, as mentioned, is residential, which is zoned
RUF. The plan shows that he would construct a 6,167 square
foot building. It would be located towards the front of the site.
One of the problems is the front yard setback for M-1 zoning is
50 feet. The building is only about 35 feet in the front yard
setback, so therefore he would have to get a variance from the
Zoning Board of Appeals. The floorplan shows a general open
floorplan with a shop area, an office, and unisex bathrooms.
Required parking for this type of facility is 12 parking spaces.
Shown are 12 along the west property line. One of the conditions
of a special trade contractors' yard is that the site has to be
enclosed by a fence. He is proposing to enclose the parking area
and the area behind the building with six-foot high chain -link
fence. The building materials are similar to the other buildings on
Rosati, it is gong to be constructed of brick and split -face block.
The front elevation and front half of the side elevation would be
brick and the remaining portions of the building would be the split -
face block. Another condition is that if it abuts residential, and
this property does to the south, is that he has to incorporate a 20-
foot-wide greenbelt between the residential properties and he is
showing that. That area has to be planted with two rows of
appropriate trees. He is showing two rows of trees, so it is
conforming to the ordinance. Also, the front yard has to be
landscaped. He is showing trees in the front yard. Along the east
property line he has a greenbelt that would have trees in it. For
lighting, he is showing along the top of the building LED light
packs. There would be no light poles in the parking lot. That is
the extent of the plan.
Jr.
Wilshaw: Okay, Mr. Miller. Correspondence is reasonable similar?
January 11, 2022
30351
Mr. Miller: Yes, The Treasurer's office has no objections. The Finance
Department has no objections. The Inspection Department has
no objections. The Police Department has no objections. The
Fire Department is the same thing of no objections, but they
would like a Knox Box to access the building and a key must be
for the access fence. The Engineering Department same thing.
No objections and that the stie has access to public water mains
and sanitary sewer. The stormwater sewer within the Rosati Ave
right-of-way, the developer would need to meet current
Engineering requirements for the proposed project, including
storm water detention per the latest version of the Wayne County
Storm Water Ordinance. That is the extent of the
correspondence.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Miller. Any questions or comments from any of
our commissioners for our planning staff? If not, we will kind of
resume where we left off with Mr. Emling. Here we are on the
site that you would like to put your contractor yard. I think we
have pretty much heard your reasoning for that. Is there any
other questions from any of our commissioners, specific to this
site?
Mr. Caramagno: There was talk earlier about a temporary easement to allow you
to store your materials outside while the construction of the
building takes place. Why cannot that be used for this property?
Mr. Emling: I am not sure if I understand it correctly. There is a temporary
easement granted for the heavy equipment. For the high lifts, the
pallets of block, and stuff that can sit outside that no one is going
to walk up and pick it up and put it in their truck and drive off while
no one is around. As you noticed, this area is barely developed,
and it is left alone majority of the time. The stuff that we are
talking about is stuff that can be picked up and carried away,
piping and fence gates that are already made and ready for
dumpster enclosures, pipe that we buy in bulk that is sitting on
pallets nice and orderly, they aren't laying all over all crisscrossed
all over the yard or leaning on the building or nothing. These are
items that can be ... somebody that had any knowledge or desire
could come up and get access to them and that is our fear. We
have all of our smaller stuff and light -duty stuff in the buildings.
Like I said, ceiling tiles, toilets that we buy in bulk, and different
things that we buy for different builds that we keep in the building,
and I hope that kind of clears up your question, what are we doing
with that area that we want to enclose or fence in. I run a
business and I have for 33 years in the City of Livonia. We just
want to protect, and nothing against the city or nothing, it is a real
lonely street at night and on the weekends and I might get three
January 11, 2022
30352
cars go by there and that is because Mitten Automotive is test
driving these cars going by on that street all day, so when it is left
alone and as you know, when things are sitting idle like that
creepers come around at night and just look for stuff to take. We
just want to protect what is ours and I am not asking for...to
leapfrog this waiver from building to building, we are going to stay
put at this building because we like that spot of the whole
development, so we want to stay there and start developing
around that.
Mr. Caramagno: It seems that we have leap frogged over the last week from what
you wanted to do and what you want to do now. There is some
leap frogging going on from last weeks study session and from
what I understand this wasn't an item until the Inspection
Department came and seen you and said put your stuff away
behind a fence, so until the Inspection Department came, this
wasn't' an issue of theft or outside storage. Is that right or did I
miss hear that last week?
Mr. Emling: No, you misheard it. I took on everything you all said at the
meeting into consideration. I went home and slept on it and said
why am I going to do this, and I don't know which person made
the point and highlighted this issue that once I get the waiver for
Lot 12 and we don't know who is going to move in there next, I
have a good idea of who is buying my property, but what is he
going to store outside? Do I want to burden the city with that
because that doesn't feel right to me? I am trying to do the right
thing and I am asking for waivers. I can drive all over this town
and see people without outdoor storage and no fences around
them. I am not trying to be like that. Here I am trying to follow the
rules and do the right thing and I am getting beat up for it, so I
guess to answer your question is, no I am not leapfrogging and
then changing my ideas. I took everything that the board said last
week, and I said let's meet everyone halfway. Let's cancel Lot
12. Why put that...'cause I don't know who is moving in and
doing what to it once I get the waiver. I fight for the waiver and
let someone reap the benefit. So, I am trying to back off of Lot
12 and focus my efforts on a building that I want to stay put in for
the next six years. I know what we are going to store out there
and I know we are backed up against residents. There is a six-
foot wall there that I just had all repaired because it has graffiti all
over it and everything from years of people beating it up and
abusing it and kicking walls through it and driving their SUV's
through there. I am doing nothing but developing the
neighborhood and making it better. If you go down there and you
will see the whole block wall, 200 feet of it, just been repaired. I
did it. To update the development and the neighborhood. I am
January 11, 2022
30353
not asking for anything out of line, but to walk the legal line to give
me a waiver to do some outdoor storage of small equipment.
Mr. Caramagno: What I heard last week was that you were going to stay in the
building that backs up to the tracks and then that has changed
since in a week's time. That's changed. So, when I say
leapfrogging, I understand that things happen. Someone wants
to buy that building now, so that deal is off the table, and now you
are going to build a building across the street backing up to the
residential property and you want to keep your building materials
there. I understand. Until when? Until someone wants to buy
that building?
Mr. Emling: No. That has been my goal to build over there. I don't want to
be against the tracks. I don't like the noise; I don't like the
vibration. I don't like anything at all about being backed up to
tracks. I don't particularly need a building that backs up to the
tracks which is more desirable to a contractor with a small
business like ours where they can do and do more things outside.
Work a little later in their yard without interrupting the neighbors
or... it is more desirable to be backed up against the tracks there.
I don't need that. I had an opportunity to sell it and we have a
deal on the table. Nothing is 100% yet, but yeah.
Mr. Caramagno: Okay, thank you.
Mr. Wilshaw: Alright, any other questions for our petitioner? Mr. Emling, I just
want to clarify. This is something that Mr. Caramagno just asked,
and I am not sure if I heard the answer clearly, but you are looking
to build out this particular lot and get the ability to store your
materials in the fenced in yard and I understand why. Are you
looking to stay and keep ownership of this building during the
construction of the rest of the development?
Mr.
Emling:
Yes.
Or.
Wilshaw:
So, this is going to be your
homebase?
Or.
Emling:
Yes, this is where I want
to keep my building. This one is just a
little bit bigger so that it is
up against residential, and we have the
block wall there instead
of the noise of the tracks and
I don't
need ... like I said we are
looking to put this one in for our home
base for the next six years.
We will develop around it.
Mr.
Wilshaw:
Once you are done, then
you would put it on the market and sell
it?
January 11, 2022
30354
Or. Emling: At that point, or at least a minimum of six years. I am going to 66
and that's it. God willing.
Mr. Wilshaw: I understand. Alright, good. an you. Any other questions
from any of our other commissioners? If not, there is no one else
in our audience wishing to speak for or against this item, which I
failed to mention at the last petition as well. If there is no other
questions for our petitioner, then a motion would be in order.
On a motion by Long, seconded by Ventura, and unanimously adopted, it was
#01-02-2022 RESOLVED, That pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held
by the City Planning Commission on January 11, 2022, on
Petition 2021-11-02-24 submitted by R & E Landscaping and
Construction, L.L.C. requesting waiver use approval pursuant to
Section 6.58 of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance to
construct and operate a special trade contractors' yard at 34413
Rosati Avenue, located on the west side of Stark Road just south
of the CSX Railroad in the Southwest '/4 of Section 28, the
Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City
Council that Petition 2021-11-02-24 be approved subject to the
following conditions:
1. That the architectural site plan identified as Sheet No. DA-
1.0 dated November 15, 2021, prepared by Arista Design,
Inc., is hereby approved and shall be adhered to.
2. Subject to a determination by the Inspection Department,
the petitioner may be required to obtain a variance from the
Zoning Board of Appeals for deficient building front yard
setback and any conditions related thereto.
3. All parking spaces, except the required handicapped
spaces, shall be doubled striped at ten feet (10) wide by
twenty feet (20) in length as required.
4. That the landscape plan identified as Sheet No. L-1.0 dated
December 16, 2021, as revised, prepared by Arista Design,
Inc., is hereby approved and shall be adhered to.
5. That the proposed White Dogwood trees within the twenty
foot (20') wide greenbelt along the rear property line shall be
replaced with full-size evergreen type trees subject to the
review and approval of the Planning Department,
6. That all disturbed lawn areas shall be sodded in lieu of hydro
seeding,
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30355
7. That underground sprinklers are to be provided for all
landscaped and sodded areas and all planted materials
shall be installed to the satisfaction of the Inspection
Department and thereafter permanently maintained in a
healthy condition.
8. That the exterior elevations plan identified as Sheet No. DA-
1.0 dated November 15, 2021, prepared by Arista Design,
Inc., is hereby approved and shall be adhered to.
9. That all rooftop mechanical equipment shall be concealed
from public view on all sides by screening that shall be of a
compatible character, material and color to other exterior
materials on the building.
10. That all outside storage shall be restricted to the enclosed
fenced -in area behind the building, as shown on the
approved site plan. Storage within this area shall be limited
to construction -related materials and no more than two (2)
vehicles. Any changes in the location and extent of the
outdoor storage yard shall first be approved by the Planning
Commission.
11. That there shall be no outdoor storage of junk, tires, debris,
hazardous chemicals, or disabled/inoperative equipment
and vehicles anywhere on the premises.
12. That the owner must provide a "Knox Box" (fire dept key box)
for fire department after -hour access to the building.
Additionally, a key must be provided (in the "Knox Box") for
access to all fenced in areas as well.
13. That any pole -mounted light fixtures shall not exceed twenty
feet (20') in height and shall be aimed and shielded to
minimize stray light trespassing across property lines and
glaring into adjacent roadways.
14. That the trash dumpster area and encloser gates shall be
constructed in accordance with the Dumpster Enclosure
Details, as shown on the approved site plan.
15. That only conforming signage is approved with this petition,
and any additional signage shall be separately submitted for
review and approval by the Zoning Board of Appeals.
January 11, 2022
30356
16. That the specific plans referenced in this approving
resolution shall be submitted to the Inspection Department
at the time the building permits are applied for; and,
17. Pursuant to Section 13.13 of the Livonia Vision 21 Zoning
Ordinance, this approval is valid for a period of one year only
from the date of approval by City Council, and unless a
building permit is obtained, this approval shall be null and
void at the expiration of said period.
FURTHER, the Planning Commission recommends the approval
of a Conditional Agreement limiting this waiver use to this user
only, with the provision to extend this waiver use approval to a
new user only upon approval of the new user by the City Council.
FURTHER RESOLVED, That notice of the above hearing was
given in accordance with the provisions of Section 13.13 of
Livonia Vision 21 Zoning Ordinance.
Mr. Wilshaw: Is there any discussion?
Or. Wilshaw, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted. It will go on to City Council with an approving resolution.
ITEM #4 APPROVAL OF MINUTES 1,180th Public Hearings and
Regular Meeting
Or, Caramagno, Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda, Approval of
the Minutes of the 1,180th Public Hearing and Regular Meeting
held on December 14, 2021.
Or. Wilshaw: Mr. Long was absent from that meeting and that leaves us with
three people to approve those minutes.
Or. Ventura: I will make the motion.
Mr. Wilshaw: Thank you, Mr. Ventura. If we only have three votes to approve
it doesn't constitute a quorum, I think it would be safe to move
this to the next agenda and we will approve the minutes from that
meeting and this one at our next regular agenda. We are
essentially tabling the minutes or moving them to the next
agenda.
On a motion duly made, seconded and unanimously adopted, the 1,181St Public
Hearings and Regular Meeting held on January 11, 2022, was adjourned at 9:06
p.m.
January 11, 2022
30357
CITY PLANINING COMMISSION
Sam Ccamagno, Secretary
ATTEST:
Ian Wi s aw, Chairman