Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAboutPLANNING MINUTES 1977-01-11IV/ 6266 MINUTES OF THE 328th REGULAR MEETING AND PUBLIC HEARINGS HELD BY THE CITY PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF LIVONIA On Tuesday, January 11, 1977, the City Planning Commission of the City of Livonia held its 328th Regular Meeting and Public Hearings in the Livonia City Hall, 33001 Five Mile Road, Livonia, Michigan. Mr. Daniel R. Andrew, Chairman, called the Public Hearing and Regular Meeting to. order at 8:05 p.m. , with approximately 200 interested persons in the audience. Members Present: Daniel R. Andrew Esther Friedrichs Jerome Zimmer Judith Scurto Joseph Falk Herman Kluver William Scruggs . Members Absent: Suzanne Wisler *William DuBose Messrs. John J. Nagy, Planning Director; Ralph H. Bakewell, Planner IV; H G Shane, Assistant Planning Director; and Robert Brzezinski, Assistant City Attorney, also were present. Mr. Andrew then informed the audience that if a petition on tonight's agenda involves a question of vacating an easement or rezoning any property, this Commission only makes recommendations to the City Council and the City Council, after holding a Public Hearing, makes the final determination as to whether a petition is approved or denied, and if a petition for a waiver of use request or a site plan is denied, the petitioner then has ten days in which to appeal the decision to the Council for relief. Mrs. Friedrichs, Secretary, then announced the first item on the agenda Petition 76-10-3-8 by Burton Johnson requesting the vacating of an 18 foot wide alley located north of Joy Road between Louise and Beatrice in the South- east 1/4 of Section 35. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Shane, any correspondence in the file regarding this petition? Mr. Shane: Yes, we have a letter from the Engineering Division regarding the overhead Detroit Edison and Michigan Bell facilities in this area, requesting that a full width easement at this location be retained for these utilities. Mr. Andrew Is the petitioner present? Burton Johnson: Yes, - I own these two lots - #243 and 244, with a fence on the 8083 Beatrice • rear of the property.. My house is located on the north lot. And there is an easement in the rear that is 18 ft. wide. I • believe it is City property, 120 feet in length. I am requesting that I be allowed to move the fence back 9 feet at my own cost as this space is not being used by the City at all. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Johnson, do you understand from the correspondence from the Engineering Division that the utilities in that location wish to retain a full-width easement for overhead servicer 4 Mr. Johnson: Yes, I understand that. Mr. Scruggs: Are there any other fences along this alley? 6267 Mr. Johnson: No, I put up this fence myself. ) Mr. Zimmer: Do you have some sort of arrangement, Mr. Johnson, with your neighbors on the west side of the alley for using the full width of the alley? Mr. Johnson: Yes, we have a small garden there and some trees, nothing really substantia] There is a small apple tree that will be transplanted in. the spring. When I move my fence, I will be gaining only half of the alley - only 9 feet. Mr. Andrew: Is there anyone in the audience wishing to speak either for or against this petition? There was no one present wishing to be heard regarding this petition and Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the public hearing on Petition 76-10-3-8 closed. Mr. Johnson: Is there anything in the law that says how soon I have to move the fence. Mr. Brzezinski: No time limit. • On a motion duly made by Mr. Scruggs, seconded by Mrs. Scurto and unanimously adopted, it was • #1-1-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-10-3-8 by Burton Johnson requesting the vacating of an 18 foot wide alley located north of Joy'Road between Louise and Beatrice in the Southeast 1/4 of Section 35, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City Council that Petition 76-10-3-8 be approved for the following reasons: (1) The actual alley has never been developed and no abutting property relies on the use of the alley area for access purposes; therefore, there is no need to retain the alley dedication as it would serve no practical purpose. (2) The Engineering Division of the City of Livonia has indicated no objections to the vacating, subject to the retention of the easement to protect the overhead utility services. (3) All other alley dedications of similar location in the neighboring • areas have been vacated. FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice of the above public hearing was published in the official newspaper, the Livonia Observer under date of 12/23/76, and notice of such hearing as sent to the Detroit Edison Company, Chesapeake & Ohio Railway Company, Michigan Bell Telephone Company, Consumers Power Company, and City Departments as listed in the Proof of Service. Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution adopte Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-1-43 by Naomi R. Clark to rezone property located on the north side of Seven Mile Road, east of Fitzgerald in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 5, from RUF to C-2. Mr. Andrew; Any correspondence in the file regarding the petition? Mr. Shane: Yes, we have correspondence from the Engineering Division relative to the dedication of Seven Mile Road b2Vi: Mr. Andrew: is the petitioner present. .t) Philip R. Ogilvie: Yes I am Philip Ogilvie, here representing Mrs. Clark and her Attorney for three daughters - Betty Miller, Shirley DeBoutte, and Bonnie Mrs. Clark Ostrum - who currently own this property under petition. The property was originally owned by Mr. Samuel Clark, who passed away in 1968. He left this property to his wife, his three • daughters and Thelma Brown, who now lives on the site. I think a little history in connection with this situation is in order at this time. Mr. Clark put up a square dancing building at this spot in 1939, and has been operating it as a square dance hall ever since that time, even prior to the formation of Livonia as a City. *Mr. William DuBose entered meeting at 8:20 p.m. Mr. Ogilvie: It is the only building with a non-complying use status in the area. . Unfortunately, a fire developed in the dance hall in September of 1976. One of the grandsons was there at the time. He stated that the fire started in the rear, of the building. Unfortunately, the Livonia Fire Department had some problems in getting water. No water whatsoever. Consequently, it took about 15 minutes before they could get water on the building. By that time, the building was more than 50% destroyed. For all practical purposes, you could say it was totally destroyed. Cannot be considered as a non-complying use now. The only avenue left would be to present a petition seeking rezoning to C-2 classification. Dance halls are subject to waiver use approval under the C-2 zoning. I have many more than the 75 signatures required to retain this location as a dance hall. Have had numerous conferences with John Nagy regarding the non-complying use status of this building. This is the only square dance hall in all of metro Detroit devoted exclusively to square dancing. Dickinson Junior High handles some square dances, as well as Northville Square, but the people want to come back to the Modern Squares Dance Hall. She is doing everything she can to hold on to her callers and her clientele. Admittedly, she is not making much money. She wants to hold this operation together. This is a busy operation every night of the week, even on Sundays and matinees. There has never been any problems. As a matter of fact, I operated it myself for several years. And I do feel that there are sufficient inequities to justify rezoning this land to C-2. There are a lot of people in support of this petition. I have with me over 4,000 signatures. People standing here with tears in their eyes. Some of these people have been dancing on a gymnasium floor, but that is not conducive to square dancing. Mrs. Clark owns lots 37, 38, and 39, and would like to put the new building closer to these lots. The old building was quite close to the property directly east of there. We feel that we can hook up into the City's sanitary sewer along Seven Mile Road. Previously, there was a septic tank. Be assured that the new building would be used exclusively for square dancing. Mr. Andrew: Thank you, Mr. Ogilvie. When did your client acquire Lots 37, 38 and 39? Mrs. Clark: I acquired Lot #38 in 1970, Lot 37 in 1972, and Lot 39 was already in the estate, probably to begin with. I Mr. Andrew: Mr. Shane, last Tuesday I asked Mr. Nagy to determine what deed restrictions existed along Fitzgerald Avenue. Mr. Shane: We did contact the City Assessor's office to try and help along these lines. This particular subdivision does not have any deed restrictions cqnnected with it. 6269 Mr, Andrew: Any questions from the Commission? Mr. Scruggs: Mrs. Clark, in asking for the rezoning of this property, would that include the house now standing on the property and the property to . the east as well? Mr. Ogilvie: All the property as shown is now being used by Mrs. Clark and her daughters. Thelma Brown now lives in that house on the property. Mr. Scruggs: Do I understand correctly that this particular house will not be . torn down? Mr. Ogilvie: That is correct - the house will not be torn down. Mrs. Scurto: What about that green structure on Lot .#37? Mr. Ogilvie: Yes, that will be torn down. Mrs. Scurto: You have no intentions to sell the land --- all the land will be used? Mr. Ogilvie: Yes, that is correct. Mr. Andrew: Relative to the comment about tapping into the sanitary sewer, Mr. Shane, does the line run along Seven Mile or Fitzgerald? Mr. Shane: The sanitary sewer line is across the road from this property along IIFitzgerald, and is fairly new - about 5 or 6 years old. 4 Mr. Andrew: Any more questions from the Commission? Mr. Scruggs: Mr. Ogilvie, I have never had occasion to use this facility, but I can see that there are many others who do, judging from the number , who are attending this Public Hearing. As far as this facility • being used as a Dance Hall, one of my concerns as a Planning Commissioner is that we put the property into its proper zoning classification, • which is C-2, But I am greatly concerned about a C-2 zoning along this avenue. How late does the dance hall stay open? Mr. Ogilvie: No later than 1130 p.m. Mr. Scruggs: So you are saying that it is pretty well cleared out by midnight. Mr. Ogilvie: Yes, that is right, but we also have dances on Saturday and Sunday afternoons. Mrs. Clark: On Sundays, the teenagers come in from 1:00 p.m. to 5:00 p.m. Then we have beginners from 7:00 to 8:00, and a workshop from 8:30 to 10: 30. On Saturdays, we have dancing from 8:00 until 11:00. Mr. Scruggs: Any alcoholic beverages sold? Mr. Ogilvie: They don't want them. Mr; Scruggs: Are you planning to put up a building the same size as previous? tI Mrs. ClarK: We would like to put up a building approximately 1/3 larger than what we had before. Mr. Zimmer: How many people would you say attend these dances? 6270 Mrs. Clark: Probably between 150 and 200 people at any one time. •I Mr. Andrew: Any more questions from the Planning Commission? Is there. anyone in the audience who wishes to speak either for or against this petition? Wm. Kolak: I live adjacent to the dance hall right. here on Seven Mile Road. And 36700 Seven as far as rezoning the property, they want to rezone three times as Mile Road much property as they had before. I am opposed to those signatures as I live immediately adjoining the property. The people who signed that paper don't live around there. Alcoholic beverages. There are alcoholic beverages consumed there every night. You should have seen the Vet bill I had to pay because my horse cut his hoof stepping on a broken bottle. Whiskey bottles, beer bottles. Maybe. they don't drink inside, but they sure do come out to their cars and drink. Mr. Andrew: Let the gentleman speak. Mr. Kolak: I know of what I speak. This is the area (pointing to the map) where they throw bottles over the fence. Talk about trouble with that place. My son-in-law went over to talk with them the night before it burned down, and asked them to please ask their customers over the PA system to please put their empty bottles back in their cars. We don't really object to drinking, we just don't expect them to throw their empties over the fence. This goes on seven days a week around the clock. I am telling you that this is a heck of a place to live next door to. I cannot understand how you can accept a petition with the signatures of 4000 people who don't even live near there. What will happen to the property if after a while Mrs. Clark gets tired of the business and decides to close it down, what about that section right next to us - what will go in then, a drive-in, like A & W? Mr. Scruggs: Mr. Kolak, how long have you lived at that location? Mr. Kolak: Since 1968, before that I lived in Coventry Gardens, and before that in Redford. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Kolak, I would like to point out several things to you at this time. Assuming that the rezoning should be accomplished by the Council, there are two additional petitions required before any construction could commence on that site. First, they would have to petition for a waiver use request just to operate the business, and then a .site plan would have to be approved for the building and parking. There is quite a long process to be followed even if this petition is approved. Mr. Kolak: One more bit of information. I can only add that they don't seem to want to do anything in the way of cooperating. I have asked them to use their PA system, and ask the people not to throw their bottles on to my property. They have never done that. It seems they don't want to embarrass their clientele. Mr. Andrew: Any more questions? Mr. Zimmer: Mr. Kolak, where does your property end on the west side? Mr. Kolak: (Pointed to the map) . . 6271 Mrs. Scurto: Mr. Kolak, you say your mother-in-law owns this property? How long has she lived there? 1[: Mr. Kolak: Quite some time, I don't know exactly. Mrs. Scurto: Was the Modern Squares dance hall there when she moved into the house, and was it used as a dance hall prior to 1939? Mr. Kolak: I don't know. . Mrs'. Sorah: I live right on Seven Mile Road directly across the street from the 36697 Seven parking lot. At the time they came ground with the petition, right Mile Rd. after the fire, I signed the petition in sympathy. But now I would like you to know that I would want to withdraw my name from this petition. Mr. Andrew: Counselor, have these 4000 signatures been filed with either the City Clerk or the Planning Commission? Kindly give the list to Mr. Shane as a matter of public record. Mr. Falk: Are there addresses as well as names on the petition? Mr.. Ogilvie: Yes, there are. Mr. Zimmer: What is the actual total amount of property that they want this expanded to? 110 Mr. Shane! Originally, they were on 1.3 acres, The Petition now involves approximately 2.26 acres, approximately twice the original. Mr. Zimmer: Isn't there some requirement that they need the approval of those neighbors within a 300 foot radius: Mr. Shane: In order for a waiver use request to be acted upon favorably, there must be the signatures of at least 75% of those neighbors within 300 feet radius. Mr. Zimmer: That would include the people along Seven Mile Road on the south side. • Mr. Shane: Yes, it does. Mary Ott: I have been a resident of Livonia for 17 years, and I have three children 14413 Stone- who like to go to this dance hall and square dance. Really, there house aren't too many places around here where teenagers can go and enjoy themselves. John O'Grady: We are not in opposition to the Modern Squares Dance Hall. It is just 36585 Seven the idea of all this property being rezoned for General Business. Mile We have a really nice home across the street that we have worked hard to get. We keep our homes up. I know the barn was there for a long time before it burned down; but it certainly never looked like it was kept up. The people who live across the street have to look at it. Why 410 wasn't it keep up a little bit? I am not against people having a good time dancing, but I feel that they should have kept the place a little bit more presentable. Samuel Machus:I married into the family that lives right next door to the barn on 36720 Seven the east side. And I can say for sure that my wife's horse stepped Mile on a broken bottle. Maybe we should back up a little for some history. 6272 Back when Mr. and Mrs. Beneut bought this property, the property line was around two feet short because of the building standing on the line. When the building burned down, that of course eliminated the fence line. A new fence has yet to be erected to replace the one that burned. It was an old building. It was'a real attraction to the younger kids in the neighborhood. They would force themselves in, and drink and smoke cigarets, and ixse it more or less as a hangout. Many times I would try to chase them out. And after every dance I would have to go in there and pick up beer bottles and pop bottles. I have had many vet bills for bruises on the horse. This L-shaped building (pointing to the map) , my wife's grandfather built. Their parking lot is directly adjacent to our property with the drain running through out to Fitzgerald Avenue. Headlights from the cars shine through our bedroom windows sometime right up until 12:00 midnight. Even though the place closes, some of the young people stick around there much later. I work long hours, and don't like the lights shining through the windows late. The people who come to the hall are not from the Livonia area. I believe that people have a right to have a good time and dance, but not in a residential area. Mary Wetherby: The kids that go there are not there until late at night-square 15215 Woodmont dancing ends at 5:00 p.m. I certainly wouldn't call that the middle Redford Twp. of the night. There is no drinking there, and they don't allow to smoke and I can prove it. The callers do not let us run around the parking lot. People who do get punished. Square Dancing closes down every summer until September. No dancing at all from June until September. I really like square dancing, but now I have to go to Northville. They have square dancing at the Northville Shopping Mall. We are allowed to park there without a pass. There are Security Guards there all the time. But really there is nothing wrong going on in Northville, the same as there was never anything wrong going on in Livonia. But this place in Livonia was the only square dancing place around. I don't want to have to go to Northville from now on. Doris Baker: I used to live in Redford, but now we live in South Lyons. I used to 56617 1.0 Mile dance at the barn when I was younger. At first it was the old fashioned South Lyons square dancing, and then we went into the western style. I think that there are a lot of square dancers in the area. My four children square dance. My son has called for the beginners' lessons for 13 years now. We are one unhappy family because there is no barn. We used to go over there at 1:00 on Sunday afternoon, and the teenagers stayed until 5 o'clock. Always my teenagers would be home at 5:30 for dinner. I can hardly see that these teens would be throwing bottles over the fence. Sunday is the only day they have to square dance. I 'll admit there may be a few "bad apples in the barrel ' . But when the parents like square dancing, you can be sure that their children will like it too. Best recreation there is. There is not one thing that I would rather do than square dance. I am-sure that Mrs. Clark's new building will loo* a whole lot better than the old one. I bet that there are a lot of square dancers who will be willing to help put up a better looking building. There are people here who can help her every step of the way. This is the way square dancers are. We do not have liquor there, maybe someone has brought in liquor. There is a special rule against drinking - not allowed while square dancing. Even on a night like last night with all this snow, I would have been here any way to support this petition. Neighbors across the street say that the barn will take their property values down, but they bought those homes when the barn was still there. If the barn had not burned down, we 6273 would be dancing tonight. Square Dancing should be done on a wooden floor - I hate to dance on a tile floor. John Midlar: We moved into our house in June, across. the street from the barn. 36623 Seven This is a residential district. Why didn't we get any notice of Mile this meeting? Mr. Andrew: The Tax Rolls of the City of Livonia are used, and notices are sent to the occupants of the house as of January 1, 1976. Mr. Midlar: Well, as far as those ladies from Redford and South Lyons, they aren't bothered with the lights. But let them come into my house, and see What's been happening. I strongly object to the rezoning of this property to C-2. Mr. DuBose: Did you know the barn was there when you bought the house in June? Did you know that they had square dancing at the barn? Mr. Midlar: Yes, I did. Valerie I have lived in Livonia for 21 years, the past fourteen at the present Sarinopoulis: address. I was raised at this address on Seven Mile Road, and from 36700 Seven my experience, I agree that the famous Modern Squares dance floor is Mile conducive to barn dancing --- it is very loud. In the summertime, when it is very hot and we have to open our bedroom windows in order to get some cool air, between 11:30 and 12:00 Midnight we can hear 200 people jumping up and down, yelling' YAHOO, very disturbing to our rest. I 10 am sure that all the neighbors will agree to that. If they put up a new building, would it in any way be sound-proofed? Again, since this is a residential area, we would probably have another problem. The parking of all the cars. Sometimes during the winter storms, the parking . lot would not be plowed out, and the cars would pull into our driveway. Sometimes they would park in front of our driveway, blocking us in. We did call a tow truck and the Police Department, and on two different occasions tickets were issued. I can see two specific problems - noise and parking. Ray Stringer: I have lived in Livonia for twenty-four years, and I really appreciate 32660 Green- what the City has done for us - like the golf courses and all. I never land Ct. thought I would begin square dancing, but I did in 1971. What is the objection to having some fun in the square dancing hall? We have dances at the Senior Citizens Building. We have to have something to do. All we want is to have some fun. Why can't we come to some sort of compromise to make the neighbors satisfied. Maybe something could be worked out. Resident: I have lived here in Livonia for eighteen years, and I represent all the 29215 Grove young people here tonight. We go to the Modern Square dance hall every Sunday until 5 o'clock. Maybe there is someone in the group drinking, but they really don't belong to the group. There really is no other place for us teenagers. We certainly can't get into any trouble at the barn. There is no drinking or booze. Just one nice place of recreation where we will be safe. Mr. Scruggs: Ladies and gentlemen, all the things you people are telling us here at the' Planning Commission could very well be true. No one is objecting to square dancing as such. , What really is before us is whether or not we can rezone this property in a residential area to a C-2 classification. What will the rezoning do to the entire area? That is what we are trying to consider here tonight. 6274 Max Scarr: I just want to say that I certainly agree with these people about beer o 18399 Uni- bottles and cans being thrown out onto the street. I live in the 4 versity Woods Condomiums down Newburgh from the dance hall, and we get more Drive beer bottles and cans at our entrance than you would believe. They say there is no drinking at the barn. You just can't stop people from drinking and throwing away their bottles. As far as the parking along Seven Mile, that's true. I know that people park on the shoulder • and block driveways. It seems that the Police Department just isn't doing their job. ' Joan Meyers, I am an attorney representing my family, Mr. and Mrs. Midlar, who Attorney live across the street from the barn. If this rezoning request is 1704 Brent- approved, what precedent will that establish regarding the remaining wood, Troy property in this area? Or do you have enough reason to deny another Daughter of petition? I do not feel that the operation of the Modern Squares John Midlar should be continued. Certainly there is enough other commercial property-in Livonia where they .could build another dance hall. The old barn is gone. We are asking you to uphold the,Master Plan and allow this area to remain residential. • Chris Heck: I am not opposed to them building another dance hall in this area, 19188 Fitz- but I don't feel that Lots #37, 38, and 39 should be rezoned commercial. gerald If it is the same as before, OK. Just rebuild it on the same site. Opposed to rezoning the other property around it. Jerry Marsh: I feel the same as Mr. Heck. Fitzgerald is a dead-end street. If 19175 Fitz- they rezone the lots on the corners, that will bring a lot more traffic gerald on Fitzgerald. Not opposed to rebuilding on the same spot, and I suppose the house on Lot #37 will have to be torn down. d I4 Cathy Deneut: They are talking about putting up a bigger building twice the size of 36720 Seven the old one. What about the parking for all those cars. There should Mile be some sort of rule about how close they park to our property. Mr. Andrew: The City has no interest at this time as to whether or not the barn is rebuilt. The question before us is the rezoning of the property. John Casey: I just recently built my house, and at the time I bought the land, 19377 Fitz- the barn was there. I had no objections. When Mrs. Clark came gerald around with her petition, and my wife and myself signed it, we had no idea that she had three more lots. We have no objection to the rebuilding the barn, but we are -,opposed to the rezoning of the other three lots. Reginald Bentley: I live in a 12 story apartment building in Dearborn, and when 21800 Morley the building was being put up, a lot of the neighbors had objections. They were afraid that it would lower their property values. Do you know that instead it has done just the opposite. The area is more desirable now than it was. This is where the importance of ' planning comes in. Why can't they build this barn exactly where it was before, but maybe just slighly larger. Would not increase the number of dancers. With 20 squares, you would still have 160 people. These people do not drink. It is just not possible to drink and square dance at the same time. We go there two nights a week, and are always out of there by 11: 15 p.m. Mrs. Clark IlL certainly didn't know the barn was going to burn down. Maybe they could come up with some different arrangement. for the parking. People complain about parking on the edge of the road and block driveways. If they had the additional property, that would alleviate the parking problem. Why doesn't Mrs. Clark invite the 6275 neighors to come over and see how much fun the square dancers are having? Maybe they will join in. 1110 Mr. Falk: Please, let's ,just have new information only. We make a recommendation to the Council, and if these people wish to make all their feelings known, I would suggest that they appear before the Council when they have their Public Hearing on this petition. If anyone has any new input, please come forward. • Catherine Southern: I understand that the barn burnt down because the Fire Department 16103 Norborne couldn't get enough water right away. Isn't it the obligation of Redford the City to see that the hydrants are in good working order at all times? Mr. Andrew: That is a legal question, cannot answer that here. Mrs. Southern: Sorry. Paul Bryan: I moved to Livonia thirty-one years ago. I pay my taxes just the 18573 Westmore same as these people who pay $65 and $75 thousand dollars for their homes. I have been paying for the sewers and schools for a lot longer than they have. I was a good friend of Jesse Ziegler and Harry Wolfe, and these men also like to square dance. If more of the older people would speak up, we might get our hall back. Metty Miller: I .am the oldest daughter of Mrs. Clark and I would like to say 12441 Camden that it seems to be that when you plan out a City, you plan especially for the middle class family, and not the rest of the 44 • citizens. What about finding someplace for the kids to go? Sure there is a penny arcade somewhere around Plymouth and Middlebelt, but I think you should plan something like dancing for the kids who 4 live here. John O'Grady: Four years ago when I paid my taxes they were high; they were $1365. 36858 Seven Mile This year they went up to $1900. I always vote for the school millage. But I still think that the people in this neighborhood have the right to object to any commercial zoning in a residential area. I don't feel .that the people from outside the neighborhood can tell us that we have to put up with commercial zoning. . Mr. Falk: Mr. Nagy, how much property is actually needed to be rezoned C-2 to accommodate the erection Of a new barn, and could a smaller portion be rezoned C-2 and the remaining zoned for parking, rather than give a C-2 classification to the entire area? Mr. Nagy: No site plan as yet has been submitted so that we can determine what the area requirement is. With the little information that we now have at this hearing we are not able to determine specific off-street parking count. Mrs. Friedrichs: Evidently the people here are not aware that there are other places in the City to square dance; for instance, the Senior Citizens Building, certain schools in the area, and the Community Education 11 Services offers many opportunities in their newest book. J Mr. Zimmer: If the building had not burned down, and there was a change in ownership, could it have continued to be used as a dance hall?u j Mr. Nagy: These of the property runs with the land, and not the person who owns it. . 6276 Mr. Zimmer: Was there anyone in residence there who had an interest on a day to day operation of the facility, anyone person living on the property. i Mr. Ogilvie: Miss Brown currently lives in the house there. Mr. Carr is the square J dance caller and Mrs. Clark and her three daughters oversee the general operation, as well as the clean up and maintenance. Mr. Falk: It appears that the residents don't really object to the barn if it, were built on the same site, and would comply with the ordinance of the City. Other residents are complaining about a C-2 zoning in a • residential area. The City Council as well as the Planning Commission are obligated to hear both sides: Based on facts, we must have an effective plan in developing the remaining parcel - equally and fairly and still stay within the confines of the Zoning Comprehensive Map. If I remember correctly, in the past we have denied petitions for commercial zoning along this area on Seven Mile Road. If we don't deny this petition we are not living up to the Comprehensive Map. We would be hard pressed to defend this decision in a court • of law. We have to vote within the confines of the law. Perhaps, we should table this question now, and look into the situation more closely. Mr. Zimmer,: If the dance hall had not burned down, could there be any. improvement of the property in a commercial way without going through a rezoning procedure? Mr. Nagy: No, a major improvement of the property along these lines would not 4 . automatically be permitted. a Mrs. Friedrichs: Is there any way legally that there can be conditions imposed on the C-2 zoning, as long as the property is being used in a commercial way, and then if the business is discontinued, the zoning could revert back, to the residential zoning? Mr. Nagy: No, legal opinion is that we cannot condition any rezoning.- Mr. Falk: We cannot arbitrarily chahge the zoning on our Compreshensive Map. Once we make a decision on rezoning, we must stay with it. The Council can still change our recommendation. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Ogilvie, where does Mrs. Clark now live? Mr. Ogilvie: On Merriman Court, just east of Merriman Road, north of Seven Mile Road. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Ogilvie, does Mrs. Clark charge admission to the dance hall? Mr. Ogilvie: Yes, there is an admission charge - so much per head. All proceeds are divided between the owner and the caller. After the fire, Mr. Kolak approached me as to what we would do about the property. I told him that we wanted to rebuild the barn but probably would have to request a rezoning to C-2. He asked me if I would include his property also. I explained to him that I thought there were certain 11 equities in Mrs. Clark's favor that would not apply to any other - property. He then said that he would be forced to voice an objection to the rezoning. I am the City Attorney in Northville, and I feel sure that there is some possible solution here. First ofall, the matter of whether or not we can obtain a C-2 zoning. The people next door have stated that, in the fire, their fence burned down, but they have never requested that we rebuild it. As far as lights shining into people's bedrooms, I am 6277 ' sure that they can be directed away from those spots. As far as the tremondous noise in the summertime, Mrs. Clark would like to have the COnew building air-conditioned. The new building will not .be allowed 4 to go to rack and ruin. Let's face it, any site plan must be approved by your board. As for the other problem, people are worried that with a C-2 zoning here, somebody might want to put up a McDonald's - I am one of the many attorneys in the State of Michigan who are concerned about current zonings. Justice Levin supports the approval of the application of contract zoning. You can only zone a piece of property for a particular use. Multiple zoning does not call for a maximum use of the property. With respect to the question: do we need all of Lots 37, 38, and 39? We feel that we will need at least 113 parking spaces. We do have a tentative plan drawn up, as yet not submitted, which shows the building 80' from the road. We might not need #37, but we considered using 38 and 39 for parking. The old building was insured for $60,000 but the cost of a new building is close to $125,000. Mrs. Clark is willing to do this, and has already made arrangements if we get the "go ahead" . Other locations were out of sight as far as costs are concerned. For here use as a dance hall, with a limit of 150 to 200 people a night for three hours in the eyeing, there is no way she would be able to obtain any other C-2 property and still operate her business. I will do anything I can to help these people obtain their new dance Hall. Bonnie Ostrum: There is a specific reason for wanting all three lots. Investigation 18346 Myron shows that there is just not enough land to put up a new building • and have all the parking required if we don't get all three lots 1 rezoned. Mr. Scruggs: I feel that we have had a lot of very good input in this direction., Although I don't know where I want to go on this item, as it stands now, I feel that I would approve the rezoning of this property to C-2. I feel that some compromise could be accomplished, and we should table • this petition to a later date. Mr. Ogilvie: I would be available to attend any Study Session you would care to set up. Mrs. Scurto: Are there any homes .across the street, across Seven Mile Road, from Lots 37, 38 and 39? Mr. Ogilvie: There are three houses. Mrs. Scurto- To the west of Margareta. • Mr. Ogilvie: Yes. Mrs. Friedrichs: I would request the Legal Department look into the possibility of deed restrictions limiting this property to square dancing use. Mr. Brezezinski: Mr. Ogilvie should come into our office for a discuss on this matter. Mr. Zimmer: Perhaps there is an alternative to the conditioning of commercial zoning. As far as I am concerned, if this proerty is going to be commercial with no restrictions, I would be opposed to that. Certain modifications would have to be made. 4 There was no one else present wishing to be heard on this item and Mr. Andrew, Chairman declared the public hearing on Petition 76-12-1-43 closed. 6278 On a motion duly made by Mr. DuBose, seconded by Mrs. Scurto and unanimously adopted, 4 it was . #1-2-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-43 by Naomi R. Clark to rezone property located on the north side of Seven Mile Road, east of Fitzgerald in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 5, from RUF to C-2, the City Planning Commission does hereby determine to table Petition 76-12-1-43 until the Study Meeting to be conducted January 18, 1977. Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. Mr. Andrew then invited the petitioner, her attorney, and representative group of citizens to attend the Study Session of 1/18/77 if they so desire. Mrs. Friedrichs, Secretary, then announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-1-45 by Rouge Valley Construction Company to rezone property located on the east side of Merriman between Bobrich and Bennett in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 11., from RUF and R-5 to R-2. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding this petition. Mr. Nagy: Yes, we have a letter dated January 8, 1977 from the Merri-Six Civic Association being opposed to the petition for rezoning of subject property. Request Planning Commission to deny petition. Also, a letter dated December 16, 1976 from the Engineering Division indicating no problems related to the proposed rezoning. l!'to Mr. Andrew: Is the petitioner present? Mr. Zimmer: Could someone tell me what area is included in the Merri-Six Civic Association? Mr. Nagy: I believe it is bounded on the east by Merriman Road, between Six and Seven Mile Roads, possibly running westerly to Hubbard. Dick Pastor: I am the petitioner, and wish to state that I just recently acquired the property. I feel that this area could be subdivided into 38 lots , with 95% of the lots being 76' wide or wider and the remaining lots narrower than 76 feet wide. There is no other logical way to develop this parcel. Mr. Andrew: Any questions from the Commission. Mr. Zimmer: How deep would your lots be with bnly 282' to work with? Mr. Pastor: 111 feet deep. Mr. Zimmer: Is there anything wrong with that particular dimension for depth? Mr. Nagy: R-2 District regulations require minimum depth shall be 70' x 120' or a total of 8400 square feet. Therefore, lots only 111' deep would dr) te be less than the minimum depth required. However, there is a provision in the City ordinance that states that if you have fixed immovable. boundaries, the lot depth could' be waived as long as the lot area 4 and lot width are still complied with. Mr. Pastor has a valid argument in that he is faced with an immovable boundary on the north - Bryant Junior High, and the Binder & Lark subdivision on the south. • 6279 4 There is no other way to develop this parcel with a road extending through the middle. We checked with the Chief Building Inspector regarding the lesser lot depths, as long as the widths and total areas were met. The Chief Building Inspector agreed that the condition exists of fixed immovable boundaries. Mrs. Scurto: Mr. Pastor, do you intend your road to be a continuation of Jeanine Avenue, as shown on the map? Mr. Pastor: Yes; I do. Mr. Scruggs: Mr. Nagy, what is the minimum size lots required, both width and depth, in an R-1-A district? Mr. Nagy: In an R-1-A district, minimum lot sizes would be 60' x 120' , with a total of 7200 sq. ft. Mr. Andrew: Any one in the audience wishing to speak either for or against this petition? • John C. McFall: My lot backs into the property under consideration. 30990 Bobrich: The area is known as Brookwood Estates and compromises about 270 home's. Back in 1971 when our homes were being built, we came before the Planning Commission, with Binder & Lark, seeking a rezoning. People in the Merri-Six area were on half-acre lots and wanted il that zoning upheld. Well, as it turned out, our lots are on half- s4 i10 J acre or better, and we would like to see the zoning in this area continue as it is. Mr. Andrew: Do you feel that this area could be developed as half-acre lots? Mr. McFall: Yes, but it would probably result in half as many houses. He could put a road on the north of the property, and build houses only on one side of road. Mr. Scruggs: Mr. McFall, what about those lots already on Jeanine to the east? Mr. McFall: Those lots are in an R-1-A district. Mr. Scruggs: I really feel that if Mr. Pastor developed this area into half-acre lots, the costs would probably be outrageous. Mr. McFall: When Binder & Lark requested the rezoning back, in 1971, they wanted to put in two streets to develop homes. Butthose areas to the west of Merriman insisted that the half-acre zoning be upheld; and at that time, the Planning Commission denied the request for rezoning to 70' x 140' lots. All those people in the R-1-A district should have a voice in this. 111' depth lots are not enough, 120' would be better. • Mr. Scruggs: Mr. McFall, within the City ordinance, there is a provision that states where there is an immovable boundary, as far as depth is concerned, 'the lir' amount of the width can be increased in order to meet the minimum square ILfootage required. James Sumach: We live in the R-1-A district just east of the proposed development,wood 17538 Rexand we are opposed to this rezoning. It appears that when these new homes 6280 are built in the R-2 district, they will be far less than the homes in the R-1 area. We don't want that to happen. Betty Bjarnesen: We live on two acres along Merriman Road next to the property 17820 Merriman under construction. The property that Binder & Lark developed had once belonged to my father-in-law. It was at this time that there was a request for rezoning just like the Brookwood Estates behind us. The request was brought before the Planning Commission who said that they should not be rezoned, must go to half-acre lots. My question here tonight is what will happen to the old house on the property right next door, and ,what will happen to the old barn practically falling down? Mr. Andrew: We have no guarantee that this developerwill be the ultimate builder of the homes in this location. Right now he has the right to go and make the subdivision improvements. He might want to sell some of the lots to a particular home builder, and then maybe keep some of the lots for himself. Betty Bjarnesen: I would like to know what type of homes he is planning to put in this area, similar to those in Brookwood Estates, or what? Dick Pastor: I am more than willing to comment to these people that I will put good looking homes in this area, face brick with attached garages. The zoning restrictions call for homes in an R-2-C classification being at least 1500 sq. ft. in a ranch and 1800 sq. ft. in a colonial. I am more than happy to live with these restrictions. All buildings currently on the property will be torn down. Mr. Andrew. You mean in order to obtain rezoning and improve the land you would amend the petition to an R-2-C classification? Dick Pastor: Yes, that is correct. Mr. Falk: What price range on these homes? Dick Pastor: I would say mid 50's to high 60's. Mr. Falk: Not below $50,000. Dick Pastor: I don't think so. Diane Perry: My one big concern is the overhead power lines. Currently we don't 31311 Bobrich see them. When the builder develops this land, are the trees going to be cut down? Mr. Andrew: Are not the lines along Merriman Road underground? Isn't there some restrictions that power lines have to be buried? Dick Pastor: All improvements will be underground, but there is an Edison sub-station right here (pointing to map) . That is an existing transmission line and cannot be put underground. r-NJames Dodds: Regardless of the size of the lots, I feel that these homes with less than t 30600 Jeanine 2000 sq. ft. priced in the mid 50's would be of much lesser value than those homes in the surrounding area now. I truly feel that putting up this type of home would definitely depreciate our property. 6281 Mr. Scruggs: Mr. Dodds, what is the approximate size of your home and lot? Mr. Dodds. I live on a 60 x 120 lot with a home having more than 2000 sq. ft. Mrs. Friedrichs: The way I understand it is that the lots would be widened to 76' , because with a depth of only 111' that would allow the total square footage of the lot to meet the requirements. Mrs. Scurto: I am interested in a little more background regarding the Binder & Lark development. When they came before the Planning Commission they asked to put up a lesser house than they got. Is that correct? Also, lesser lot size. Diane Perryt Yes, they told the Planning Commission that they wanted the lots to be less than half-acre. The lots had to be half-acre lots. So then we had to pay the price for the homes that are required on half-acre lots. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Pastor, is there any possibility at all of having only one row of houses facing the road? Dick Pastor: Economically, no. Of course, it could be done, but we have to pay for improvements twice on the same lot. Improvement costs for houses on only one side of the road would be prohibitive. Economically, impossible to do it. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Nagy, would it be possible to retain this RUF zoning, and develop Ili, smaller square footage homes? Mr. Nagy: The RUFC zoning classification would require at a minimum one story homes with a floor area of 1500 sq. ft. Ray Sterling: My main concern parallels what happened when Binder & Lark developed 17618 Rich- Bobrich Avenue extending it westward. There developed a substantial land increase in traffic in that area. If we change the lot size in this new development, there would be a greater density of houses and cars traveling down. Jeanine eastward. There would just be another street leading out to Merriman which would certainly increase the traffic in this area. I feel that you should stick with the same restrictions now present. 1 Resident: My wife and I purchased our home on an assumption, and I would say 31224 Bobrich that we possibly have a half-acre lot to the rear. I agree with Mr. McFall that this land should be continued to be zoned as half-acre lots. The new lots under consideration would be backed right into our lots. Currently, this land is a greenbelt, with a school behind that, and it is a beautiful treed area. It is a nice place for kids, going to and from school. If it is developed, I am sure the green belt would be eliminated. We just don't want smaller starter homes in this area. Paul Peters: I live just around the corner from the entrance to the subdivision. 17426 Sunset And I would like to know if this gentleman purchased thisproperty without knowing what the zoning was on it. When he purchased the land, how did he feel that this was going to be changed and what type tri of homes can we be sure he will put on that property? ILMr. Andrew: Mr. Pastor, do you care to answer these questions? Dick Pastor: When I purchased the land, I was totally cognizant of the zoning. I have a valid purchase agreement which does have contingencies. I do 6282 tnot feel that a 1500 sq. ft. house that sells for over $50,000 can be considered a starter home. I have made a commitment to protect the entire neighborhood. I didn't come into this community to bastardize any one neighborhood. I have made commitments and I will live up to them. This piece of property being subdivided can in no way have any effect on the value of the other property in the area. Mel Spackey- Eleven years ago I moved to Brookwood Estates. I selected that particular 17463 Sunset: house because of the dead-end street, and the trees shielded us from tie school yard. I feel my children were safe from traffic. Let's face it, the City has changed in the last eleven years since I moved in. However, I will be frank. I have a 12 year old house that is probably worth around $50,000. And I am concerned with the density proposed by this man - smaller houses on small lots. Al O'Connor) Something was mentioned about the overhead powerlines. Isn't there 30846 Bobrich 20 ft. easement on the back of our lots that could handle the power from the main power feeder in that area? \ Mr. Nagy: We really don't know where the easement falls exactly. Al O'Connor: Well, if these lots are only ill ft. and they take off 20 ft. for an easement, that would allow only 91 ft. on which to build a house. At the present time, I understand that the house has to be 30 ft. away from the street, so how are they going to put up any kind of house in that small a space? It is going to be a real botched up mess. Bob O'Connell: At one time this property was proposed to be zoned R-1. Then someone , ! 17551 Hillcrest came before the Board and the Board said they had to be half-acre lots. Why can't you do the same here? Mr. Andrew: We really do not know the history surrounding that rezoning attempt. Betty Bjarnesen: There really was no specific zoning on the land at that time. My father-in-lowhad a 15 acre piece, and when somebody wanted to buy the property, he sold it to them. At that time, the builder wanted to make the lots a certain size conforming with the regulations of an R-1 district. But that was not approved by the Commission for the lots on Merriman, Curtis, Vargo and Bennett. They said the lots had to be at least half-acre. Mr. Falk: I think we should be aware that according to the provisions in the local ordinance, Mr. Pastor can be allowed to build in this area if we decide to rezone the property. It just goes back to the old saying "Buyer Beware". You can't restrict property adjacent to you. From past know- ledge, I would say that Mr. Pastor has built many beautiful homes in the town, and what he is asking now is within the ordinance. Mr. Scrugg: Mr. Pastor, the R-2 classification, how would that compare with an R-1-A? I believe the property to the east was developed by Sullivan & Smith and I think they started their ranches at approximately 1200 sq. ft. , and the colonials at 1700 sq. ft. I really don't know who the subdivision ended up with but I am sure that this developer complied with the minimum requirements and still put up beautiful homes. i Mr. Pastor: The only classification we could possibly work with would be the R-2. Keep in mind the consideration of the front footage. I understand we must have at least 76' of front footage. 6.283 Mr. Andrew: Mr. Pastor, with an R-3 classification, according to my very rough calculations, 82' wide lots could be put in on a 50' right-of-way making the depth of the lots 116' . Do you think it is possible for you to develop the land under these conditions? 4 Mr. Pastor: I think possibly that could be looked into a little further. What would be the square footage required in an R-3 District? Mr. Nagy: 9600 square feet. There was no one else present wishing to be heard and Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the Public Hearing on Petition 76-12-1-45 closed. On a motion duly made by Mr. Scruggs, seconded by Mr. Kluver it was #1-3-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-45 as submitted by the Rouge Valley Construction Company to rezone property located on the east side of Merriman between Bobrich and Bennett in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 11, from RDF and R-5 to R-2, the City Planning Commission does hereby determine to table Petition 76-12-1-45 until the Study Session of January 18, 1977. A roll call vote on the foregoing resolution resulted in the following: AYES: Kluver, Friedrichs, DuBose, Zimmer, Falk, Scruggs, Andrew NAYS: Scurto ABSENT: Wisler Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution adoptee He then invited the petitioner, as well as representatives from the home owners in the i area, to attend the Study Session of 1/18/77 if they so desired. Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-1-46 by the Automobile Club of Michigan to rezone property located on thewest side of Hubbard, south of Five Mile Road in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 22, from R-7 to P. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding this petition? Mr. Nagy: We have a letter dated 12/16/76 from the Engineering Division indicating no problems connected with this petition. Also, a letter dated 1/6/77 from Mr. Robert Ditzenberger of 15125 Hubbard in opposition to this petition. Mr. Andrew: Is there a representative from AAA here? I would presume that we are being asked to rezone this land into the actual use of the land. I understand that since 1956, and even before that, this space has been used as a parking lot for members of the Auto Club. We are being asked to put the Zoning Map into compliance with what actually exists. Mr. Nagy: Our current Zoning Ordinance was drawn up in 1965, and perhaps an error existed in allowing this land to remain R-7 at that time. The first I have heard about any water problem in this area was in a conversation I had with the man who wrote this letter, Mr. Ditzenberger. 1 Francis Huxley: Yes, we are in the process of purchasing that land immediately behind our parking lot. We wish this additional space in order to expand our present parking facilities. I am the manager of the Branch Real Estate Department of the Auto Club of Michigan, with headquarters in Dearborn. 6264 Robert My main purpose for being here is that this petition is congruent fig Ditzenberger: to the next petition. And I am very concerned about the drainage 15125 Hubbard along Hubbard Avenue. There is no man-hole in this area, and the street is paved right up to the adjoining lot, graded down the street flowing down Hubbard because of the grade. I know this property was zoned R-7 when I purchased by house, and I looked at the parking lot and the three houses next to it. It would appear there is not enough' acreage here to put in a parking lot. When I went to the Planning Commission office, I did not see where there were any permits issued to pave the lots. Mr. Andrew: The Planning Department does not issue permits .of any kind. You should have gone to either the Engineering Department, or the Bureau of Inspection. Mr. Ditzenberger: What about the driveway that was put in this past summer? Mr. Andrew: Cannot answer any of your questions regarding permits. Mr. Falk: All we want to do here is put the proper name of zoning on the right piece of land. We just want to be able to change the color on our Zoning Map to indicate parking in this area. We believe that since this error was brought to the attention of the City, we have an obligation to correct it. Mrs. P. Ditzenberger: How is it possible that the AAA was able to use this land for parking all these years if it was not zoned for parking? Mr. Andrew: They probably have been using it that way even prior to the adoption of our current Zoning Ordinance. I would say that we made a booboo II: in not changing it before. Mr. Nagy: In 1965, Zoning Ordinance #60 became obsolete, and the City adopted a new Ordinance #543, Every parcel of land had to be put into its proper classification and in a few cases errors were made. In a way we are trying to correct that situation by this rezoning petition. There was no one else present wishing to speak further on this petition, Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the Public Hearing on Petition 76-12-1-46 closed. On a motion duly made by Mr. Kluver, seconded by Mr. Falk and unanimously adopted, it was #1-4-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-46 by the Automobile Club of Michigan to rezone property located on the west side of Hubbard, south of Five Mile Road in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 22, from R-7 to P, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City Council that Petition 76-12-1-46 be approved for the following reasons: (1) The proposed change of zoning to the Comprehensive Zoning Map is corrective in nature in that the subject property is used in. its entirety for parking purpsoes, and with this change the zoning map q will reflect the actual use of the property, and 1 (2) the proposed change of zoning will bring the Comprehensive Zoning Map into conformance and thereby eliminate the non-compliance the property currently has with respect to the R-7 multi-family district regulations. 6285 • FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice of the above Public Hearing was published in the official newspaper, the Livonia Observer under date of 12/23/76, and notice of such hearing was sent to the Detroit Edison Company, Chesapeake & Ohio Railway Company, Michigan Bell Telephone Company, Consumers Power Company, and City Departments as listed in the Proof of Service. Mr. Andrew declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-1-47 by Jerry J. Rozema, Cardinal West, Inc. , to rezone property located on the .west side of Hubbard, south of Five Mile Road in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 22, from R-7 to P. • Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding this petition? Mr. Nagy: Just the letter from Mr. Ditzenberger in opposition to the petition, as well as a memo from the Engineering Division indicating no problems in connection with the proposal. Mr. Andrew: Is the petitioner present? Jerry Rozema: Yes, we own the property extending from the parking lot to the back. Mr. Andrew: I understand that the house there is rented at the present time, and it is your proposal to sell the land to AAA, remove the house and pave the lot. It Mr. Rozema: Yes, we have that in mind. Mr. Zimmer: How long have you owned the house? Mr. Rozema: Just about three months. Mr. Zimmer: • What about the people living there, did you find another place for them? Mr. Rozema: Yes, we found another home for them to purchase, guaranteeing them the sale of this home. We didn't sell the home immediately, therefore, our realty firm acquired the property. Mrs. Scurto: If you want to change the classification to parking, what do you plan to do with the property next to that on which there are two remaining houses to the south? There does''t seem to be enough land to build any more apartments. Mr. Rozema: , It would be unlikely that more multi-family dwellings would be constructed. Perhaps, a small professional office building. This area could not support a four or eight unit condominium. Mr. Ditzenberger: Here again, I would like to point out a few facts before the Planning Commission : 1) the parking in this area is bad at night; 2) prevailing winds blow debris on my property;3) the drainage problem should be looked into; 4) my bedroom is at the north end of my house, which is only 15' from the parking lot. 6286 Mr. Andrew: Do you own the house with the dog on the mailbox? Mr. Ditzenberger: That is my house. Mr. Scruggs: How long have you lived in that house: Mr. Ditzenberger: Four and a half years. Mrs. Friedrichs: If the parking lot is to be, extended to this man's property, wouldn't a wall be required? Mr. Andrew: Yes, a wall would be required. Mrs. Friedrichs: A wall along the parking lot would certainly contain the trash more effectively. However, I would like to see that the site plan for the parking lot would show that the lights would be directed solely toward the lot so that very little light would go toward Mr. Ditzenberger' property. As far as the students from Bentley parking in this area, I have been a long time Bentley parent, and I would say that almost all events at Bentley are over by 10:30 p.m. And they are usually only on Friday and Saturday nights, amybe sometime during Sunday; but not during the week. Mr. Ditzenberger: Well, what about the snow plow in the parking lot, comes within 15' of my house. How big of a wall do you suggest? Mr. Nagy: The wall would have to be no less than 5' and no more than 7' . Solid masonry. Mr. Ditzenberger: Well, I am against such a wall. Mr. Huxley: I would just like to make a few comments, if I may. I know the parking problems at our Livonia branch is quite bad. We have about 65 employees and only maybe 65 to 70 parking spaces. That does not leave much room for our members who come into the office a place to park. We made attempts to have our members come together to work in one car (pool cars, you might say) , but that does't seem to be working. Some interest, but not too much. Now, some of our members are forced to park out on the streets or just wherever they could. We feel an obligation to provide them with better parking facilities. As far-as the drainage problem is concerned, we will do whatever we can in connection with what the Livonia Engineering Dept. advises. If there is something more that should be done, we will do whatever we can to alleviate the situation. I have nothing more to add except that we are trying to do the right thing for our employees and our members in enlarging our parking area. Mr. Ditzenberger: Isn't that property across the street, where the gas station used to be, couldn't that be made available for parking? Mr. Nagy: Yes, that land is for sale, and has a PS classification. Would not be available as commercial parking lot, but could be used for parking in connection with a business use. 6287 1[14 Mrs. Ditzenberger: Again, I would like to say that my husband and I have lived here for four years. We have two Great Danes, and in all the four years, we have never heard any complaints about our dogs. They have a separate run which backs up to the fence, along the whole length of the back yard. When the dogs bark, I go out and bring them in, or stop their barking. The Hanson's were in their house two weeks before they even knew we had dogs. If they put in a parking lot, with people coming and going all thettime, the dogs will be barking constantly I can't stand it myself; my neighbors can't stand it. We have improved our property in many ways, and the only thing they could be done now would be to install a storm sewer along the whole length of the property. As far as the parkinglot is concerned, it is zoned for Multi-Dwellings, why can't you leave it that way? . Mr. Andrew: Mrs. Ditzenberger, there is just not enough land to allow this to remain zoned R-7. There was no one else present who wished to speak further regarding petition and Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the .Public Hearing on Petition 76-12-1-47 closed. On a motion duly made by Mrs. Friedrichs and seconded by Mr. Dubose, it was RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-47 as submitted by Jerry J. Rozema, Cardinal West, Inc. , to rezone property located on the west side of Hubbard, south of Five Mile Road in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 22, from R-7 to P, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City Council that Petition 76-12-1-47 be approved. The gavel was passed by Mr. Andrew, Chairman, to Mr. Scruggs, Vice Chairman. Mr. Andrew: I would like to suggest that this petition be tabled for the purpose of allowing time for additional information to be acquired to see if some other parking plan could be worked out which would have a minimal impact on Mr. Ditzenberger's property. On a motion duly made by Mr. Andrew, seconded by Mr. Falk it was #1-5-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-47 as submitted by Jerry J. Rozema, Cardinal West, Inc., to rezone property located on the west side of Hubbard, south of Five . Mile Road in the northwest 1/4 of Section 22, from R-7 to P, the City Planning Commission does hereby determine to table Petition 76-12-1-47 until the Study Session to be conducted on 2/1/77. A roll call vote on the foregoing resolution resulted in the following: . AYES: Kiuver, Scurto, Falk, Scruggs, Andrew NAYS: Friedrichs, DuBose, Zimmer IlLABSENT: Wisler Mr. Scruggs, Vice Chairman, declared the above motion is carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. Mr. Scruggs returned the gavel to Mr. Andrew, Chairman. Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-1-48 by Gerald C. May to rezone property located on the north side of Ann Arbor Road, west . 6288 1[1 of Newburgh in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 31, from R-1 to C-2. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding petition?. Mr. Nagy: We have a letter from the Engineering Division Mr. Andrew Marvin Stempien, what are your comments? I understand that you are representing the petitioner? Marvin Stempien: This basically is another one of those pieces of land that predates the Livonia City Ordinance. Mr. May has just recently purchased the property, and at the time he knew that it had a non-conforming use. After reviewing the land thoroughly, he has decided to upgrade the land and put in a new structure. It is much in need of replacement. Mr. Stempien: We have already contacted the Health Department as well as the Building Inspector, as well as others involved in government - such as the Police Department, Fire Department, and the State Licensing Board. All parties agree that there should be an upgrading of the real estate. It certainly has to be upgraded to keep in conformance with the classification so that we may apply for a building permit. Another serious problem is the financing of such a project along with making a profit. We are now in the process of obtaining a mortgage on this property. Mr. Scruggs: If Mr. May has already purchased this property, and has been operating it since the first week of December, and has already begun to make improvements it would appear that he has a good working relationship with the Building tepartment, the Fire Inspector, and the Health Dept. How soon do you wnat to start the new building? Mr. Stempien: Possibly in the summer, depending on the outcome of obtaining money to work with. We anticipate that the timetable will probably stretch out as long as twelve months, or even two years. I realize that it would have to be programmed carefully with the Building Inspector. The property to the east is currently owned by the Wayne County Road Commission, and they will allow that to be used for parking, pursuant to an agreement we have with them. Mr. Falk: Mr. Stempien, would it be any hardship on your client if we were to table this petition until a later date? Mr. Stempien: No problem. There was no. one present wishing to be heard further on this petition and Mr. Andrew declared the Public Hearing on Petition 76-12-1-48 closed. On a motion duly made by Mr. Falk, seconded by Mr. DuBose, and unanimously adopted, it was • Il #1-6-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-1-48 by Gerald C. May to rezone property located on the north side of Ann Arbor Road, west of Newburgh in the Northeast 1/4 of i Section 31, from R-1 to C-2, the City Planning Commission does hereby determine to table Petition 76-12-1-48 until the Regular Meeting to be conducted January 25, 1977. 6289 • Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda is Petition 76-12-2-23 by Standard Federal Savings requesting waiver use approval to construct a drive-in facility addition to the existing building located on the east side of Farmington Road, north of Six Mile in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 10. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the ,file regarding petition? Mr. Nagy: We have a letter from Engineering Division indicating no problems connected with petition. Mr. Andrew: Is the petitioner present? Tom Bencic: We would just like to add a driveway to accommodate customers at Rep. from our new drive-in facilities. Standard Federal Savings Mr. Andrew: How many additional windows are you planning? Tom Bencic: Initially, we would like to put in two, and then another one in the future. • There was no one present wishing to speak further on this petition, Mr. Andrew declared the Public Hearing on Petition 76-12-2-23 closed. On a motion duly made by Mr. DuBose, seconded by Mrs. Scurto and unanimously adopted, it was #1-7-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-2-23 as submitted by Standard Federal Savings requesting waiver use approval to construct a drive-in facility addition to the existing building located on the east side of Farmington Road, north of Six Mile in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 10, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City Council that Petition 76-12-2-23 be approved subject to the following conditions: (1) That Site Plan dated 11/29/76, prepared by Tarapata, MacMahon & Paulsen Associates, Inc. , which is hereby approved shall be adhered to; (2) That building elevations as shown on the approved Site Plan, which are hereby approved, shall be adhered to; and (3) That all landscape materials as shown on the approved Site Plan shall be installed on the site prior to issuance of a Certificate of Occupancy for the new addition. for the following reasons: (1) The proposed use complies with Zoning Ordinance #543, Section 9.03(d) , (2) The proposal represents a minor expansion of an already established d savings and loan facility in the area, and (3) The plans submitted document that the site has the capacity to • accommodate the minor expansion in use. 6290 FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice ,of the above Public Hearing was sent to property owners within 500 feet, petitioner and City Departments as listed in the Proof of Service. i 4 Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. i Mrs. Friedrichs, Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda Petition 76-12-2-24 by James Riehl requesting waiver use approval to operate a recreational storage lot on the west side of Farmington Road between Plymouth and Schoolcraft Roads in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 28. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding the petition? • Mr. Nagy: We have a letter from the Engineering Dept. indicating that storm drains might be required in this area. Mr. Andrew: Is the petitioner present? James Riehl: This land that I would like to use as: a storage space is owned by 30020 Orange- my grandfather. In talking with Mr. Shane of the Planning Dept. lawn he told me that there would have to be a solid base of asphalt put there. Currently, I have 4" of crushed concrete, but I didn't bring any drawings of the lot as a whole. I do intend to put a fence on the outside perimeter of the land. • Mr. Andrew: Is there anyone wishing to speak either for or against this petition? l':' There was no one present wishing to speak on this petition, Mr. Andrew declared the Public Hearing on Petition 72-12-2-24 closed. On a motion duly made by Mr. Falk, seconded by Mr. Kluver and unanimously adopted, it was #1-8-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 72-12-2-24 as submitted by James Riehl requesting waiver use approval to operate a recreational storage lot on the, west side of Farmington Road between Plymouth and Schoolcraft Roads in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 28, the City Planning Commission does hereby determine to table Petition 72-12-2-24 until the Study Session to be conducted February 1, 1977. Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. Mrs. Friedrichs announced the next item on the agenda Petition 72-12-2-25 by Thomas Sundberg requesting waiver use approval to operate a bump and paint shop on the west side of Middlebelt Road between Eight Mile Road and Morlock in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 2. Mr. Andrew: Any correspondence in the file regarding the petition? Mr. Nagy: We have a letter from the Engineering Dept. indicating that a storm sewer would have to be installed in this location extending southerly to Morlock. Also, a letter from Bernard DiPaolo, operating a flower shop at 20361 Middlebelt, opposing a bump & paint shop in this location. Also, a memo from Freeman-Darling Inc. , indicating opposition to such an operation in this location. 4 Mr. Andrew: is the petitioner present? T.Sundberg: I would like to buy this lot and building in order to make it big 18243 Lennane enough for my business. I realize the building needs a lot of Redford improvements, and do intend to keep all parked cars within the fencing. 6291 Mr. Andrew: Mr. Sundberg, as related to the Zoning Ordinance of the City of Livonia, , the building now standing on that lot has a deficient rear yard of 16' and a deficient side yard' of 20' . These measurements do not comply with the ordinance. This Commission cannot give you any approval if a the subject does not comply with the Zoning Ordinance. Do you own the property right now? Mr. Sundberg: No, I am trying to buy it presently. Mr. Andrew: Well, I think you should really think twice about buying this property. Because of the deficient side yard and the deficient rear yard, we will probably have to deny this petition. It does not meet with our Zoning requirements. . Mr. Falk: I would like to apologize to these people for keeping them so long, and then denying their petition, but because of the conflict with the Zoning Ordinance we cannot approve this use. Mr. Andrew: Mr. Sundberg, why don't you talk to Dan Gilmartin, our Industrial Development Coordinator, and perhaps he could help you find another piece of property in the City that would meet our requirements and your needs. There was no one present wishing to be heard regarding this item, Mr. Andrew declared the Public Hearing closed. , I4On a motion duly made by Mr. Kluver, seconded by Mr. Falk, and unanimously adopted, it was I4 #1-9-77 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on January 11, 1977 on Petition 76-12-2-25 by Thomas Sundberg requesting waiver use approval to operate a bump and paint shop on the west side of Middlebelt Road between Eight Mile and Morlock in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 2, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend to the City Council that Petition 76-12-2-25 be denied for the following reasons: (1) The proposed use does not comply with the M-1 Zoning District Regulations with respect to the general standards regarding yard requirements as well as to Section 16.11(a) , the specific waiver use standards, (2) the proposed use would not be compatible with the surrounding uses of the area and would adversely affect the abutting and neighboring residential area to the east, (3) the Industrial Development Coordinator recommends against the granting of approval of this petition, and (4) the site size, its location and arrangement of the existing site development does not lend itself to the proposed bump and paint shop in that site lacks sufficient capacity so as to avoid conflicts with adjacent uses and particularly with respect to vehicular turning 10 movements of cars in need of repair entering and leaving the proposed site. FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice of the above Public Hearing was sent to property owners within 500 feet, the petitioner and City Departments as listed in the Proof of Service. Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. 6292 On a motion duly made by Mr. Kluver, seconded by Mr. Falk and unanimously adopted, it was #1-10-77 RESOLVED that, the letter dated December 9, 1976 from John D. Dinan requesting' approval of the Planning Commission to construct a service drive on the west property line of the Village Fashion Mall located on the northwest corner of Seven Mile and Merriman Roads in the Southeast • 1/4 of Section 3, to improve ingress and egress to the Shopping Center, be tabled until a later date. Mr. Andrew, Chairman, declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. On a motion duly made by.Mr. Scruggs, seconded by Mr. Zimmer, it was #1-12-77 RESOLVED that, the Minutes of the 327th Regular Meeting held by the Planning Commission on December 21, 1976 are approved. A roll call vote on the foregoing resolution'resulted in the following: AYES: Kluwer, Friedrichs, Zimmer, Scurto, Falk, Scruggs, Andrew NAYS: None ABSTAIN: DuBose ABSENT: Wisler Mr. Andrew declared the motion carried and the foregoing resolution adopted. On a motion duly made, seconded and unanimously adopted, the 328th Regular Meeting and Public Hearing held by the City Planning Commission on January 11, 1977 was II: adjourned at 12:45 a.m. , January 12, 1977. CITY PLANNING COMMISSION ----I/464 \ fd Esther Friedrichs, Secretary ATTEST: Daniel . Andrew, Chairman