HomeMy WebLinkAboutPLANNING MINUTES 1996-12-10 15314
MINUTES OF THE 736th REGULAR MEETING AND PUBLIC HEARINGS
HELD BY THE CITY PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF
�.. LIVONIA
On Tuesday, December 10, 1996 the City Planning Commission of the City of Livonia
held its 736th Regular Meeting& Public Hearings in the Livonia City Hall, 33000 Civic
Center Drive, Livonia, Michigan.
Mr. James C. McCann, Chairman, called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m., with
approximately 20 interested persons in the audience.
Members present: James C. McCann Jack Engebretson R. Lee Morrow
Daniel Piercecchi John Walsh
Members absent: Robert Alanskas Patricia Blomberg
Messrs. John J. Nagy, Planning Director; H. G. Shane, Ass't. Planning Director; and Scott
Miller, Planner I, were also present.
Mr. McCann informed the audience that if a petition on tonight's agenda involves a
rezoning request, this Commission only makes a recommendation to the City Council
who, in turn, will hold its own public hearing and decide the question. If a petition
involves a waiver of use request and the request is denied, the petitioner has ten days in
which to appeal the decision to the City Council; otherwise the petition is terminated. The
`— Planning Commission holds the only public hearing on a preliminary plat and/or a vacating
petition. Planning Commission resolutions become effective seven days after the
resolutions are adopted. The Planning Commission has reviewed the petitions upon their
filing and have been furnished by the staff with approving and denying resolutions. The
Commission may use them or not use them depending upon the outcome of the hearing
tonight.
Mr. McCann: I would like to open tonight's meeting by announcing that two of our
Planning Commissioners who have been with us for quite some time
are leaving. I have a letter from the Mayor of Livonia to Jack
Engebretson that I would like to read into the record.
"I have received and do hereby accept your resignation from the
Livonia Planning Commission effective December 11, 1996. Please
accept my sincere appreciation and thanks for your fine service.
"In your eight and a half years of service as a Planning Commissioner,
you have effectively worked for the careful development of our city,
while striving to maintain the quality of life that we enjoy in Livonia.
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"Your actions directly affected the development and future of our City.
I know that your strong commitment to a well-planned community will
serve as a model to commission members for years to come.
"On behalf of the City of Livonia, I would like to thank you for your
dedicated service. My best wishes to you in all your future endeavors."
It should also be known that while Jack has been with us on the
Planning Commission since May of 1988, he served as Chairman of the
Planning Commission from July of 1990 to July of 1996. He also
served on the Roads Beautification Committee under Mayor Robert
Bennett. I can say he has been a good friend of mine and a stalwart for
the City of Livonia. Jack would like to save a few remarks until the
end of the meeting.
Mr. Engebretson: If that would be in order, I would appreciate having the opportunity to
thank my colleagues, the staff and the community.
Mr. McCann: Also, the longest-serving member of our Commission, Lee Morrow,
has been a member since 1977, 19 1/2 years. He came awfully close to
making it to the 20th year but decided to move out to the lake, and we
wish him a lot of success. He served as a member of the Youth
Commission prior to becoming a Planning Commissioner. He served
on the Board of Trustees for the Hearts of Livonia for at least 15 years.
He served as Chairman of the Livonia 2000 Committee, and he served
as Chairman of the Anniversary Committee for Spree. I also have a
letter from the Mayor of Livonia that I would like to read into the
record:
"I have received and do hereby accept your resignation from the
Livonia Planning Commission effective December 11, 1996.
"Permit me to take this opportunity to express, on behalf of the people
of our community, our sincere appreciation for all of your efforts and
contributions as a member of the Commission. In your nineteen and a
half years of service as a Planning Commissioner, you have effectively
worked for the careful development of our city, while striving to
maintain the quality of life that we enjoy in Livonia.
"Please accept my personal thanks for all your efforts on the
Commission. My best wishes to you as you move on to new
opportunities. Sincerely, Jack E. Kirksey, Mayor, City of Livonia"
My sentiments exactly. I am going to miss you both. Did you want to
say something Lee?
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Mr. Morrow: I will say a few words because Jack Engebretson is a tough act to
follow. I can't sum up in a few minutes all of my feelings but the
... decision to leave Livonia was not an easy one for several reasons. My
wife, Adele, she taught in the Livonia Public Schools for many, many
years. My children were raised and educated in the Livonia school
system. I had this opportunity to serve the City in the capacity of the
Youth Commission and the Planning Commission and I have worked
for three Mayors, Ed McNamara, Bob Bennett, and now Jack Kirksey.
I have enjoyed working with the Council and I have especially enjoyed
working with all the Commissioners throughout the years. I have to
mention the staff, John Nagy, who has the best memory I have ever
seen, and we rely very heavily on him. H. Shane, who when John is not
around he is equally as professional. Of course, Jean Garvey, she has
been here as long as I have been here, and Scott Miller. I can mention
all of the Commissioners but that would take too long but believe me I
will be back. I am not going that far away. I will still stay on the Heart
Fund, and I will come back to take advantage of the fine golf courses
that Livonia provides. I will come back and visit my friends. I guess in
those 19 1/2 years I have cast a lot of votes. I think I was right on
most of them but there are probably a few I would like back, but we are
not governed by past mistakes. On that note, I really appreciate the
opportunity to have served in this capacity for the City of Livonia. I
will always be proud of Livonia. It is one of the premier communities
N— in the whole United States. So with that thanks Livonia, and I guess
that is it.
Mr. McCann: Now we will do a little work. Would the Secretary please read the first
item.
(In the absence of Mr. Alanskas, Mr. Walsh acted as Secretary)
Mr. Walsh, Acting Secretary, announced the first item on the agenda is Petition
96-11-1-23 by Stuart Frankel, c/o Newburgh Plaza, requesting to rezone property
located on the south side of Six Mile Road between Newburgh Road and
Fitzgerald Avenue in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 17 from OS to AG, P and C-2.
Mr. Miller presented a map showing the property under petition plus the existing zoning
of the surrounding area.
Mr. Nagy: We have received a letter from the Engineering Department stating as
noted on the plan, several public utilities (and easements) must be
relocated and other easements vacated. It is assumed that there is
sufficient resulting grade in the sewer systems to accommodate the
sewer relocation. They end by saying they have no objections to this
rezoning proposal.
a►
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Mr. McCann: Would the petitioner please come forward and present his plan.
ti..
Stuart Frankel, 3221 W. Big Beaver Road, Troy: I am the owner of Newburgh Plaza. I
constructed it in 1972 with a 114,000 sq. ft. neighborhood convenience
center anchored with a supermarket. That has continued to exist up
until about three months ago when the major anchor of the
development, which was Food Emporium, which was a successor to
the Great Scott Supermarket, which was originally there, decided to
relocate to another facility outside of the City of Newburgh. That
leaves me in a dire predicament that I have lost the major anchor of the
retail center, which is the supermarket, which represents 25,000 sq. ft.
of the center of about 114,000 sq. ft. In order to be competitive in
today's retail environment, considering the new composition that is
going to exist in my trade area, being the shopping center at Six Mile
and Haggerty with a new Farmer Jacks at the northwest corner and the
new Shopping Center Market located on Haggerty between Five and
Six Mile Roads, it is necessary for me to try to solidify this retail
development with a major anchor. In order to do that, as you look at
retail opportunities, there are very few that can add to a shopping
center as well as a supermarket can. We have been fortunate enough to
have discussions with a major supermarket who is interested in
relocating to this development to re-anchor the shopping center and re-
position the shopping center to make it competitive in today's
environment, Without that, we will be left with a 25,000 sq. ft.
vacancy, and I think it will create a domino effect and we will lose
other tenants. In order to accomplish that, however, it is necessary to
rezone the parcel to the east of the shopping center, which is now
zoned OS. What we are asking to do is rezone a portion of the
property to allow for just the footprint of the building so that we can
construct a supermarket in this area here. The left of the area will be
zoned Parking to provide parking for the supermarket and the easterly
50 feet, we want to rezone to AG to provide a landscape buffer to the
single family residential to the east of us from the retail development.
In order to accomplish this and provide parking for the supermarket,
we are proposing to relocate the First Federal Savings and Loan to a
new location at the intersection of Six Mile and Newburgh. This does
not require rezoning. The reason for the relocation is to provide
parking for 300 cars which we need to service the supermarket. We
have met with the residents in the adjoining residential subdivision to
the east of us. They have some concerns which we have addressed,
and we will continue to address at the Planning Commission level as we
go for site plan approval, which concern landscaping and lighting.
Other than that they feel comfortable with the plan. As part of this
redevelopment we propose to create a new exterior facade for the
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entire development. (He presented the elevation plan) The vacated
supermarket would get a new facade and we would divide it into two
,` retailers, one of which is in the shopping center now and would like to
expand, that being the Rite Aid Drug Store. There would be a drive-
thru feature for the drug store operation. As part of the plan we will
redo all of the landscaping and all the medians and all the berm areas
along the front and the interior islands. We will redo the irrigation
system to make sure it is operational and will support the landscape
area. In addition to that we will redo all the exterior lighting to bring
the lighting to state-of-the arts lighting. The truck traffic and traffic to
service the supermarket will use the existing curb cuts. There will be
no additional curb cuts added to the development. The traffic will be
supported internally within the shopping center. Everybody will be
facing west as they vacate and leave the shopping center. We think this
will be a fine addition and is necessary in order to make this retail
development competitive and make it survive in the next 50 years and
be a very, very, significant factor in the retail environment in the City of
Livonia.
Mr. McCann: We will go to the audience to see if there is anyone wishing to speak
for or against this proposal.
Karen Kobel, 16692 Renwick: I am President of the Kingsbury/Renwick Homeowners
Association, and on behalf of the association I am going to speak on
N"" what the neighbors feel on this petition. The civic association held a
meeting on November 19th with Mr. Stuart Frankel and a
representative of the supermarket, being Krogers, Mr. Dave Trueter.
The rezoning proposal plans to renovate the expansion of the property
were presented to us. At that meeting the residents in attendance voted
on the rezoning and the plans for Newburgh Plaza. Seventy-five
percent of our residents in attendance at this meeting were in favor of
the proposed rezoning of this Newburgh Plaza. Many of the residents
are skeptical and suspicious however, and items we discussed at the
meeting, they wanted to be granted, and as a matter of record I will
state the following items which they would like Mr. Frankel and the
City of Livonia to be committed to: The first one being the daily
sweeping of the parking lot. The second is weekly cleaning of debris in
the greenbelt area, which is on the eastern 50 feet, which is the
proposed zoning right now. The third one being the evergreen trees to
be mainly focused in the area precluding to the driveway. In front of
the plaza there is a little street called Wood Street that juts up to the
wall. Since there was an elevation problem, they wanted a main focus
of evergreen trees there to mask the car headlights in that area. The
fourth one being the willingness of the Kroger Supermarket to keep the
delivery hours between 9:00 a.m. and 9:00 p.m. The fifth one being
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Kroger's operating hours being from 7:00 a.m. until midnight, which
Mr. Trueter said they would abide to, which in essence the neighbors
would not like a 24-hour store. The following are two other concerns
the residents had with the rezoning of the property. By shifting the
traffic now from the westerly portion of the property to more easterly,
closer to our neighborhood is the eastern most curb cut, Six Mile goes
from three to two lanes about 15 feet after that curve cut and there is a
lot of traffic hazards and safety issues we have there because now most
traffic will be coming in that lane and out of that curb cut, so maybe the
City could look into doing something different with Six Mile. I know
some mini-malls have a cut where traffic kind of veers off the road.
Something like that. This was what the neighbors were concerned
about. It is already a safety issue and they are concerned now it will be
a bigger safety issue. The last one is the street that juts out to the wall,
I guess it is called Wood Street, there are no homes on it. It is just a
dead-end street that juts up to this wall. The residents want to be
assured that in the future that street wouldn't be opened up to the plaza
in any way and maybe could be somehow eliminated altogether. That
was some of the concerns the residents had made. Lastly, the residents
would also be interested to help with the plans of the landscaping with
Mr. Frankel and there were two residents that volunteered to help with
the landscaping if possible.
Mr. McCann: John, what about the street that does jut in there? Is that something
that we should look at?
Mr. Nagy: We could vacate it. We would have to make sure the residents'
driveways aren't directly affected.
Mr. McCann: That is something we could look at?
Mr. Nagy: We will make a note of it.
Mr. Frankel: I met with the residents at that meeting and we are in agreement with
those stipulations, the sweeping of the parking lot daily, the cleaning of
the greenbelt on a weekly basis, the store hours would be 7:00 a.m., no
later than 12:00 p.m. We met with the residents tonight and they will
address that, but we are going to form a task force and as we finalize
our landscaping plan we will sit down with them ahead of time before
we submit that to the City to make sure we incorporate all their
thoughts including some of the lighting suggestions which they made
tonight. So we are in agreement with the recommendations and
suggestions of the homeowners.
Mr. McCann: What about the merge lane?
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Mr. Frankel: I am not a traffic consultant, per se and I don't know the ramifications
�.. of that to be honest with you.
Mr. McCann: Is there any need to address that with the county?
Mr. Nagy: At the time of site plan approval we will send it to the county so they
can look at it.
Mr. McCann: There was something said about 9:00 a.m. until 9:00 p.m. Is that for
deliveries? I am in business myself and I know that most deliveries
start at about 7:00 a.m.
Mr. Frankel: Nine is going to be a little difficult in the morning.
Mr. McCann: Most shopping centers load at night.
Mr. Frankel: These will be during the daytime because they come from public
warehouse.
Mr. McCann: Is there anyone else in the audience that wishes to speak.
Mike Tranquilla, 16823 Fitzgerald: That is two homes south of the south end of
Newburgh Plaza. I am on the west side of the street. I am a member
of the Kingsbury/Renwick Civic Association, and I am one of the
volunteers for the landscaping committee to work with Stuart Frankel
on trying to address some of the landscaping issues. We met with him
tonight before this meeting and I believe we are in agreement on most
areas. We have a few little details to work out. I would like to make
public, if I can, some of the things that we discussed today so I can get
them on the record. First of all, we would like to make the plaza flow
with the surrounding area. There are new places of business that have
opened up across the street as well as on Newburgh and Six Mile that
have a more up-to-date landscaping.
Mr. McCann: This is zoning and zoning only. We will be coming back with
landscape approval and for the building approval, site plan approval,
and if you will leave your name with the secretary tonight, she will
contact you and let you know when that comes forward. With that
type of issue we don't have any problem working with you when that
comes along and working with Mr. Frankel but we would like to get to
the major issues tonight instead of the specifics.
Mr. Tranquilla: The only other question I have, and I don't know whether it is part of
this meeting or not, is dealing with the grade. There is quite a bit of
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grade. I believe if you stood on the existing end of the shopping center
and looked east, if you look straight ahead, you would be looking over
the existing wall on the east end of the shopping center, and if you are
going to keep that grade flat, it would seem to me that the parking lot
would be level with the top of the existing wall. I am wondering if
anybody has addressed this issue, and how this issue is going to be
dealt with.
Mr. McCann: We haven't seen any site plans yet so we really can't directly look at
that issue. Mr. Frankel, have you looked at that issue? Is there going
to be a change in elevation near that wall?
Mr. Frankel: To be honest with you tonight is the first time they brought that to my
attention. I certainly will discuss it with the architects and engineers as
we try to lay this thing out but I am not equipped at this time to suggest
a solution to the problem.
Mr. McCann: Do you even believe there will be a problem?
Mr. Frankel: I can't say if there is or there isn't.
Mr. Tranquilla: In our opinion this is one of the better rezoning proposals that we have
had for some time in this area, and I would like to work to try to
resolve these issues.
Mr. McCann: Good, and we will have that opportunity.
Karen Kobel: On the issue of the Kroger deliveries, it was my understanding at our
meeting we had with Mr. Frankel and Mr. Trueter of Kroger
Supermarket, that the deliveries would be kept between 9:00 a.m. and
9:00 p.m., and there are a lot of concerned residents and when I heard
Mr. Frankel say 7:00 a.m,just as a matter of record they said they
would guarantee that it would be that way.
Mr. Engebretson: I would like to ask if the first six or seven residents on Fitzgerald that
border that property, if they were unanimously in favor of this
proposal.
Ms. Kobel: Three of those residents attended that meeting and many of them
voiced concerns over the garbage there. One of the residents picks up
a garbage bag full of garbage on a weekly basis from her backyard from
the neighborhood but if these items that I read previously were to be
met, then they were in agreement.
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Mr. Engebretson: As you may or may not be aware, those kinds of issues can't really be
made a part of whatever action is taken here tonight. However, when
�., the site plan approval process occurs, those kinds of issues can be made
a part of the process. So even though a public record is established
here tonight in terms of your testimony and Mr. Frankel's testimony, it
would be my impression as a non-attorney that they probably aren't
commitments that you could rely on. However, during the site plan
approval process, some of those points could actually be made a part of
the resolution and then they do become commitments that everyone can
depend on, everyone knows exactly what the agreement is. The reason
that I asked that question is they are obviously the most affected
neighbors, and I live near the shopping center and I am in that shopping
center on a regular basis, and I understand about some of the
housekeeping improvements that could be made. Would it be your
impression that if all of those things were to come to pass relative to
housekeeping, even though we are talking about zoning and we
shouldn't be getting into these things, I think the Chairman will allow
me a little latitude, a little slack here tonight since this is my last
meeting, would you say it would be your impression that those most
affected neighbors would be in favor of this proposal?
Ms. Kobel: It is my impression from the meeting we had of our association, of the
members that were in attendance that live on that street that border the
property, that they are in favor even though they are taking it with a
grain of salt.
Beverly Delor, 17007 Fitzgerald: I am one of those first seven houses that are most
affected. I am the third house down from Six Mile Road, and I am one
of the volunteers to work on the landscaping. I have spoken to Mr.
Frankel and he is more than willing to cooperate with all our ideas that
we have submitted. It is a concern of mine, the landscaping and
lighting, trash naturally, but more than that is that cut that the lady
previously mentioned. I have seen and heard a tremendous amount of
accidents in the short time that I have lived over in that area and I have
wondered what it would take to pursue possibly a traffic signal because
you have left into the funeral home, left into that Fitzgerald Street. I
don't know what it would take but I would really like to see a traffic
signal there. I just wanted you to know I am one of the seven houses
there and we are working together and we have come to some
agreement.
Mr. Engebretson: Mr. Frankel, if I may, I understand your presentation, and I think it is
very nice, particularly since you have worked with these neighbors and
have come to an agreement with them relative to being concerned
about their concerns, and I applaud you for that, but I just want to ask
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this question anyway as to why one would go to what would appear to
me to be substantial expense to do the expansion of the shopping center
`■. on the east, particularly as it relates to moving that bank building, as
contrasted with doing some creative expansion on the western end of
the shopping center. Could you comment briefly as to why you took
this approach versus the other?
Mr. Frankel: We can't get a footprint of 65,000 sq. ft. on the western side of the
development. Today in the competitiveness of the retail environment,
supermarkets have gone from 20,000 sq. ft. to 60,000 to 65,000 sq. ft.,
and without the ability to present the full merchandising array of goods
and commodities, people will not take a secondary size. Based upon
what we had to do to come up with the minimum square footage to
afford us the opportunity for the retailer to be competitive and to be
complimentary to what the other retail stores are, we needed that size
footprint and we can't make it work on the western side.
Mr. Engebretson: What about in the center of the center? I am just curious. I am not
suggesting that you should.
Mr. Frankel: To take all these ten stores out, I never could have done it. I have to
keep all the tenants happy, and this is the place where it would work.
Mr. Engebretson: It is my understanding that where you will adding the new construction,
you will be taking the Wing Yee Restaurant and Caddy Shack and the
small portion of Aco. Is that correct?
Mr. Frankel: We will be relocating. There is a building that is coming down. The
building that is coming down is where the existing golf store is and
Wing Yee's. Wing Yee's is going to be relocated into the shopping
center. The golf store facilities are going to be relocating, on their own
choice, to a location at Eight Mile Road and Halsted. We are
inconveniencing as few of the existing tenants in the shopping center as
humanly possible to make it work.
There was no one else present wishing to be heard regarding this item and Mr. McCann,
Chairman, declared the Public Hearing on Petition 96-11-1-23 closed.
On a motion duly made by Mr. Engebretson, seconded by Mr. Morrow and unanimously
approved, it was
#12-226-96 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on
December 10, 1996 by the City Planning Commission on Petition 96-11-1-23
by Stuart Frankel, c/o Newburgh Plaza, requesting to rezone property
located on the south side of Six Mile Road between Newburgh Road and
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Fitzgerald Avenue in the Northwest 1/4 of Section 17 from OS to AG, P and
C-2, the City Planning Commission does hereby recommend that the City
`., Council approve Petition 96-11-1-23 for the following reasons:
1) That the proposed changes of zoning will provide for an adequate buffer
area between the commercial and residential uses in the area;
2) That the proposed changes of zoning will provide for the continuing
viability of the subject shopping center while maintaining the concept of
buffering between residential and commercial uses;
3) That the proposed changes of zoning are compatible to and in harmony
with the surrounding uses in the area; and
4) That the proposed changes of zoning will provide for an expansion of the
subject shopping center thus providing additional commercial facilities to
serve the surrounding community.
FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice of the above hearing was given in
accordance with the provisions of Section 23.05 of Zoning Ordinance #543,
as amended.
Mr. Piercecchi: I am totally in agreement with this approving resolution. I don't think
that strip mall can survive without the anchor especially with the new
competitiveness that will soon be upon us with the Haggerty/Six Mile
Road Complex in Northville Township.
Mr. Morrow: I would be remiss if I didn't say I felt Mr. Frankel had a fine
presentation but perhaps even a finer one working with the
neighborhood. It is nice to see that happen where a developer works
with the neighborhood and even goes so far as to put a task force in
place so when the site plan comes around everyone will be happy. I
would be remiss if I didn't comment on that.
Mr. McCann: I have a couple of comments. I am going to vote for the zoning tonight
but I may have a problem with the site plan. I think putting the bank at
the far northwest corner is a mistake. I think it could be moved over
closer to the restaurant or some other location. I think that is one of
the prime locations. You have a nice looking mall. The building
elevations are coming along. They are looking nice but I dislike putting
the bank right at the corner. I think it did not help when we did that
kitty corner at Laurel Park. The mall appearance would benefit the
City more if it were moved in.
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Mr. McCann, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted.
Mr. Walsh, Acting Secretary announced the next item on the agenda is Petition
96-11-1-24 by Marvin Walkon, agent for Rest Haven Memorial Park, Inc.,
requesting to rezone property located on the northeast corner of Six Mile and
Middlebelt Roads in the Southwest 1/4 of Section 12 from AG to C-2.
Mr. Miller presented a map showing the property under petition plus the existing zoning
of the surrounding area.
Mr. Nagy: We have received a letter from the Engineering Department stating
they have no objections to the rezoning proposal. Construction of
drive approaches to Six Mile Road would require removal of the
existing bus turnaround area currently located in the Six Mile Road
right-of-way.
Mr. McCann: Would the petitioner please come forward.
William Roskelly, 33177 Schoolcraft, Livonia: Actually I am one of four petitioners but I
lost the bet and I guess I have to talk first, or perhaps it is in view of
the fact that since 1966 I have worked on or about this parcel of land
that actually lies south of the Tarabusi Drain. As you are all familiar
with the fenced area, on the extreme rear of this parcel, going in a
southeasterly direction, there is a parcel of land to the center of the
Tarabusi Drain fronting on Six Mile and Middlebelt that contains
approximately 10.7 acres of a hundred year flood plain which is on both
sides of this drain and is approximately 400 feet wide and I do have a
drawing. (Mr. Roskelly presented the drawing) As you can see this
parcel of land contains a touch under 11 acres. Of the usable land,
including this little very awkward size and shape parcel, the 6.5 acres,
the flood plain area from the center of the stream to the hundred year
flood plain is 4.75 acres. Over the years I have put together no less
than six or seven ideas from strip shopping to potential high-rise, many,
many things. Nothing seemed to work because of the restriction in the
size of the land. At this specific time what the petitioner is asking for is
a parcel of land along this corner for what will be a Walgreens Drug
Store. I would like to point out that I don't believe this is an
unreasonable request in lieu of the fact that the other three corners are
all C-2. At Seven Mile and Middlebelt all corners are C-2, and Five
Mile and Middlebelt all corners are C-2. I feel this would certainly be a
good land use and certainly would not in any way impede health, safety
and welfare.
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Mr. McCann: We will go to the audience to see if there is anyone wishing to speak on
this proposal.
Ray Tent, 18051 Deering: I happen to live in this area, and I was President of the civic
association out here, and I recognize this as a zoning item but I would
like to bring you up to speed because there is a lot of history on this
piece of property. What Mr. Roskelly indicated is true, the Tarabusi
Creek, etc. I would like to make a couple of comments for those new
Commissioners and people that don't recognize what had happened
over there. Before I get started Mr. Morrow and Mr. Engebretson, I
certainly wish you both a lot of luck. I certainly enjoyed serving with
you both. It is going to be sad for the City of Livonia because you are
taking a lot of knowledge with you, so congratulations. Six Mile and
Middlebelt, Tarabusi, Brookdale Cemetery, that is the beginning of this.
This is the zoning change. I have lived there for about 37 years. I am
sure a lot of you probably don't remember the notorious Brookdale
Cemetery that was located on that property. We had a lot of problems
with it. Also the civic association had problems with the flooding of
the lands. Brookdale Cemetery they went ahead and the problems that
were over there, we became involved with them. The bodies weren't
buried in the right place and they weren't buried properly, etc. We
�.. asked the cemetery people to clean up their act. What had happened at
that particular time, we had worked with them and nothing was done.
Years went by and I became part of the Commission here. They came
before us and they wanted to zone that corner, which is under
discussion now, to C-2 and we told them as far as we were concerned
they couldn't go to C-2 zoning unless they cleaned up their act. That
was in 1970s. What they did they put a couple of markers in there,
they fixed up the cemetery a little bit, and that still didn't meet the
specifications. That was the first petition and the last one. Then what
happened is the cemetery made a lot of improvements. They changed
hands and they came up with Mt. Hope and they have done a
tremendous job. They have landscaped it and put trees in. They have a
lot of monuments in, etc. They have done a tremendous job. Now
they are coming in here with this zoning. Representing the civic
association, the President couldn't make it, and I am past President, so
speaking for them they have no objection to this C-2 zoning going into
this particular place. The land has been barren there for a long, long
time. Everything else in the City has been developed except this. The
thing we are concerned about, we certainly don't want any 18-screen
theater in this area, we don't want McDonald's Restaurant there, we
certainly don't want China Coast or anything of that type there. I think
Mr. Roskelly mentioned Walgreens. Was that his indication of what
15327
they had in mind at this point? We don't need another Rite Aid Drug
Store at this particular location. As far as we are concerned, the
*Near residents in the area, if they put something in that would be compatible,
that is great, but we didn't want the land to be overburdened; we didn't
want the sewer to be disrupted because they had to put some piping in
there to go ahead and develop the Tarabusi. I feel comfortable with
Mr. Roskelly because I think he is a man of his word, and if he is the
person that is going to go ahead and champion the cause for this, and
look out for the interest of the location, I would go ahead and say we
are in favor. One more thing and then I am going to close Mr.
McCann. The developers are either getting smarter or we are getting
dumber. The reason I say the developers are getting smarter, they are
getting the zonings up front so they get the C-2 zoning. Then we go
ahead and try to fit a package in with those, and we are the dumb ones
because they take us to court and sue us because we won't allow them
to put anything else in that C-2 zoning. In the old days, we wanted to
make certain they would produce what they said they would put in. In
this particular case I hope the wisdom of the Planning Commission is
such that you can get a commitment as to what they will put in there
and we will go along with it. With that in mind, thank you for listening.
Mr. Roskelly: First of all I want to thank Mr. Tent for his compliment. I think I said
Walgreens Drive-Thru Drug Store, which I believe is something in the
future coming. Whether it is Walgreens, Rite Aid, whatever, I think
this is coming and I think it is something the citizens will appreciate. I
think also it should be pointed out that in the event this should be
placed, we do have a small plot plan showing it, I didn't want to burden
the board at this time but I would like to point out that ingress and
egress would be on the extreme ends or away from the intersection so
there would be no close 50 foot, 100 foot driveways coming out near
the intersection as a gas station has or some smaller uses. This land
being 290'x270', it allows us to push these approaches and driveways
far to the east and to the north away from the main intersection. I think
also Mr. Tent pointed out, I was with Brookdale, I was trying to put in
drainage years ago, but I think now, after all these years, this may be
the City's chance to put this land into a revenue producing facility for
the City of Livonia with a first class drug store.
Mr. Engebretson: I would like to echo what Mr. Tent said about Mr. Roskelly. In
matters like this, it is clear that the words that are spoken here don't
necessarily become part of the resolution, and things can change, but in
the nine years that I have observed Mr. Roskelly he has always been a
man of his word. You can always depend on whatever he had to say. I
know that there was one incident where Mr. Roskelly was very
15328
displeased with my particular stand on one issue but I think overall the
relationship has been good. I do want to also recognize something very
�.• nice he did a couple of years ago. There was a subdivision plat on Six
Mile Road where there was a request made by the descendants of the
original settlers of that land to have a street named for their family, and
they were unsuccessful with one developer, but I went to Mr. Roskelly
and made him aware of this and he very graciously consented to their
request, which meant so much to them, and it was a real gentlemanly
act and I really wanted to publicly thank him for that. I thanked you
for that privately but I think this opportunity is going to be my last
chance to say this publicly and I just want to echo what Mr. Tent said.
Mr. Roskelly is definitely a man of his word. He will do what he says
he will do. He can get a little upset, as we all can, at times, but we on a
balance have done a good job together and we hopefully will see
another successful venture here.
Mr. Walsh: I would like to make a statement before I make a motion. Mr.
Roskelly, I believe this needs to be put into our revenue stream but I
am troubled personally because I am new to the Planning Commission
and I wanted the opportunity to study this further if this is better for
OS or C-2. This has been vacant land for over some 30 years now.
The last petition was heard in 1970, if I am not mistaken, I didn't hear
it. I wanted to spend more time with this to make sure we are making
the right choice because this is a piece of only 4% of land we have
available for development in the City. I am also concerned because we
are two members short tonight by unfortunate absences due to
changing some scheduling to accommodate the tree lighting ceremony.
In addition, we will have two new members joining us. In January we
expect them to join us. For those reasons I would ask my fellow
Commissioners to be patient with this and table this for a month or
perhaps just a short while longer than that until we are back to full
strength and then we can reconsider this.
There was no one else present wishing to be heard regarding this item and Mr. McCann,
Chairman, declared the Public Hearing on Petition 96-11-1-24 closed.
On a motion duly made by Mr. Walsh and seconded by Mr. Piercecchi, it was
#12-227-96 RESOLVED that, pursuant to a Public Hearing having been held on
December 10, 1996 on Petition 96-11-1-24 by Marvin Walkon, agent for
Rest Haven Memorial Park, Inc., requesting to rezone property located on
the northeast corner of Six Mile and Middlebelt Roads in the Southwest 1/4
15329
of Section 12 from AG to C-2, the City Planning Commission does hereby
determine to table Petition 96-11-1-24 until the Regular Meeting of February
r.. 4, 1996.
A roll call vote on the foregoing resolution resulted in the following:
AYES: Walsh, Piercecchi, Morrow, McCann
NAYS: Engebretson
ABSENT: Alanskas, Blomberg
Mr. McCann, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted.
Mr. Roskelly: Now may I say something.
Mr. McCann: If there are no objections from the other Commissioners. (There were
no objections)
Mr Roskelly: I wanted to check Robert's Rules of Order. I was under the opinion if
there was proper notification, proper signage, for this specific public
meeting, that the option would be on the petitioner whether we wanted
to sit and be judged with only a portion of the Commission rather than
`.. a full board.
Mr. McCann: It is still our choice to table. We held the public hearing. The full
hearing has been held and closed and at this point we are tabling for
further information.
Mr. Roskelly: So you don't feel it was out of order?
Mr. McCann: The motion has been done. It is tabled.
Mr. Roskelly: I am only trying to understand for the future.
Mr. McCann: You may contact me at my office or contact Mr. Nagy.
Mr. McCann, Chairman, announced that the public hearing portion of the meeting is
concluded and the Commission would proceed with items pending before it.
Mr. Walsh, Acting Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda is a Motion by the
City Planning Commission to hold a public hearing to determine whether or not to
amend the Zoning Ordinance by adding regulations regarding site condominium
developments.
15330
Mr. McCann: This is a motion to hold a public hearing on this item.
sow On a motion duly made by Mr. Engebretson, seconded by Mr. Piercecchi and unanimously
approved, it was
#12-228-96 RESOLVED that, the City Planning Commission, pursuant to Section
23.01(b) of Ordinance#543, the Zoning Ordinance of the City of Livonia, as
amended, does hereby establish and order that a public hearing be held to
determine whether or not to amend the Zoning Ordinance by the addition of
Sections 2.07 and 18.67 regarding site condominium developments.
FURTHER RESOLVED that, notice of such hearing be given as provided in
Section 23.05 of Ordinance #543, the Zoning Ordinance of the City of
Livonia, as amended, and that thereafter there shall be a report and
recommendation submitted to the City Council.
Mr. McCann, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted.
Mr. Walsh, Acting Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda is Landscape Plan in
connection with Petition 96-8-2-24, which received waiver use approval to expand
the existing church and school facilities and to construct a new parish
administration office building on property located at 15089 Newburgh Road in the
,,_ Northeast 1/4 of Section 19.
Mr. Miller: This is St. Edith Church that is located just south of Five Mile Road on
the west side of Newburgh. They received waiver use approval earlier
this year to add additional church and school space and an
administration building. Part of that condition of approval of waiver
use was that they come back to the Planning Commission with a
landscape plan, and they have and that is what is before you tonight.
What they have done is they have added trees to the island in the
parking lot to help buffer the east wall on Newburgh Road. They have
also added some decorative bushes and flowers in the entranceway of
the church. The administration building, which is new, they have added
eight Austrian pines to help buffer that building from the residential
located to the south. They also stated in the plan they will seed this
area. They have transplanted a maple tree here from elsewhere on the
site so this would help this area blend in with the existing landscaping
on site. With this landscaping it is over 15% of the site so they meet
the landscaping requirement.
Mr. McCann: Any new information Mr. Nagy?
Mr. Nagy: I have no new information.
15331
Mr. McCann: A motion is in order.
On a motion duly made by Mr. Piercecchi, seconded by Mr. Morrow and unanimously
approved, it was
#12-229-96 RESOLVED that, the City Planning Commission does hereby approve the
Landscape Plan submitted in connection with Petition 96-8-2-24, which
received waiver use approval to expand the existing church and school
facilities and to construct a new parish administration office building on
property located at 15089 Newburgh Road in the Northeast 1/4 of Section
19, subject to the following conditions:
1) That the Landscape Plan marked Sheet L1.1 dated November 15, 1996
prepared by TMP Associates, Inc., is hereby approved and shall be adhered
to;
2) That underground sprinklers are to be provided for all new landscaped and
sodded areas and all planted materials shall be installed to the satisfaction of
the Inspection Department and thereafter permanently maintained in a healthy
condition.
Mr. McCann, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
, sw adopted.
Mr. Walsh, Acting Secretary, announced the next item on the agenda is Satellite Dish
Antenna Application by William Strickland requesting approval for the
installation of a satellite dish antenna for property located at 16962 Stanmoor
Drive in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 13.
Mr. Miller: This is about the fifth house north of Six Mile Road. The petitioner is
requesting to install a 10 foot satellite dish in the rear yard of his
residential property. As you can see the cross-section drawing the
applicant has provided shows the dish will be 10 feet in diameter. The
mounting pole will be 18 feet high. With the dish on the mounting
pole, the top of the dish will be approximately 23 feet in height. The
drawing also shows a Universal Broadband Antenna which will be over
the satellite dish and this will extend up to 26 feet in height. The
overall height of the whole antenna will be 26 feet and the reason for
the extreme height of this satellite dish is because the rear hard slopes
down because of the ravine that is located at the rear of the yard. The
antenna will be located approximately 30 feet from the rear of the
house and 30 feet from the south property line. The means of
screening, there are existing trees on the site.
15332
Mr. Nagy: We have letters from the residents, two to the north and two to the
south of subject area. They addressed letters to the Planning
Commission dated December 2, 1996 referencing subject satellite dish
antenna installation. We, the undersigned, would like to express our
objection to the installation of the proposed satellite dish at the above
location. It is our opinion that such a dish with the diameter and height
would be inappropriate for this neighborhood. We do object to this
installation and would like you to take this into consideration when
making your final decision. It was signed by Dawn& Paul Kilyanek of
26976 Stanmoor; Shari & Robert Davidek of 16934 Stanmoor; Pat &
Don Thomas of 16990 Stanmoor and Blaneke Pachebuca of 16948
Stanmoor.
Mr. McCann: Is the petitioner here? Is there anything additional that you would like
to inform us of since last week?
Mike Thomas: I complied with everything you asked for and rather than bringing up a
lot of miscellaneous stuff, I left a note in the back of the folder referring
to the F.C.C. ruling and you cannot discriminate or restrict, whether it
is a round satellite in size or height. The preemption and nullification
clause of the Constitution, Article IV, Sec. 2. The First Amendment
noted as Michigan Court in 1985. If you would like I can bring out the
laws and pass them out to you. One of the things we are running into
in this case is the right to recover undue cost. At this point in time
what I put into getting information and putting information before you
and obtaining the stuff for my customer, I have to refer to a Dearborn
case two years ago. They had to pay $175,000 settlement to a
customer who wanted a satellite dish, and Allen Park, I have the case
number, it is in the back of the folder, they paid $715,000 to installer
and to customer for not allowing a satellite dish to go in. If you would
like the laws, I brought copies.
Mr. McCann: No. Is that it?
Mr. Thomas: I talked to all the neighbors. The neighbors on either side, after five
hours talking to them, I got them to consent to the satellite dish but
they would not sign the papers because of the neighbors that are
moving in. Other than that I don't have anything else to say on this
other than if it steps into court, I would rather take care of it tonight
where I can show you case laws.
Mr. Piercecchi: John, are you aware of this inability to stop such an installation?
Mr. Nagy: I am somewhat aware of the laws and we are dealing with them now in
connection with our recent amendment that was before you at your last
15333
regular meeting. We have the Law Department who has advised the
Planning Commission and Council with respect to these matters. We
have a legitimate public interest in regulating these facilities. We are
still going forward with our ordinance proposal that allows the
Planning Commission to consider the placement of these with
appropriate regulations. We are not saying you shall not have them.
We are just indicating the conditions under which the standards apply
with respect to placement in the backyard, proper screening, and those
kinds of considerations.
Mr. McCann: Mr. Piercecchi, I believe what we should do is look at our ordinance,
which we all have. I think we as Planning Commissioners should vote
on it as Mr. Nagy said and if he wishes to appeal our decision to the
City Council, it is up for him to have the Council look at it and they can
get whatever opinions they want from our Legal Department. I think at
this point it is appropriate for us to vote on this within the zoning
ordinance as written at this point in time.
Mr. Morrow: I would just like to amplify that a little bit as I view it as a
Commissioner. We are certainly not telling this gentleman he cannot
put a satellite dish on a person's property. It is just like we can't tell
other businesses they can't do things, but they have to integrate with
the community. In other words, why have ordinances? Why not just
let people do things indiscriminately, put a gas station or a stamping
plant anywhere they want. My view is when we act on one of these
satellite dishes, we act on the basis of not whether they can receive that
communication but how it aesthetically impacts the City and the
neighborhood, and we are not saying not to do it. That is how I look at
it.
Mr. Piercecchi: Mr. Chairman, in all honesty I cannot oppose four residents who are
basically on each side of this particular site. They obviously do not
believe it is aesthetic in its size.
On a motion duly made by Mr. Piercecchi, seconded by Mr. Morrow and unanimously
approved, it was
#12-230-96 RESOLVED that, the City Planning Commission does hereby deny the
Satellite Dish Antenna Application by William Strickland requesting approval
for the installation of a satellite dish antenna for property located at 16962
Stanmoor Drive in the Northeast 1/4 of Section 13, for the following reason:
1) That due to its size and location, this dish antenna would be detrimental
to the aesthetic quality and beauty of the neighborhood by presenting a visual
15334
blight that could jeopardize the property values in the area as set forth in the
comprehensive plan of the Zoning Ordinance.
`er
Mr. McCann, Chairman, declared the motion is carried and the foregoing resolution
adopted.
Mr. McCann: That concludes the prepared agenda for this evening. Before we close
out I would like to give Mr. Engebretson an opportunity to say good
bye to the City of Livonia.
Mr. Engebretson: Thank you Mr. McCann. I promise to be brief I know most of you
would wonder if I can be brief I want to let you all know that I am
leaving with great reluctance. I would just like to say a comment or
two as to why I am leaving as a prefix to my remarks. My resignation
was triggered by a recent lawsuit filed against the City regarding a
zoning matter, and it was my strong conviction that the City should
have vigorously defended that lawsuit in order to protect the integrity
of our Zoning Ordinance. It turns out the City made a determination to
settle that suit rather than defend it and that had a very chilling effect
on what I perceived to be my ability to serve in the future. So when
that occurred and became a reality, I tended my resignation. That was
back in October and the Mayor asked me to serve through the
transition period through tonight, and I gladly agreed to do that. Now
I want to begin by saying when Mayor Bennett initially asked me to
No" serve in this capacity, I declined thinking it would be very boring and
something that would probably not be particularly productive but after
thinking about it a couple of weeks, when he came back the second
time, I agreed to serve for at least a while to see how it went. I must
tell you these last nine years have just been a joy, a real genuine
pleasure. I have enjoyed working with each of you, and those
Commissioners who served and have gone on, including Mr. Tent, and
of course I must also comment on the professional staff They are
competent. They are congenial , and they are cooperative. I just don't
know what more one can ask for, and every contact that I have ever
had with them has been pleasurable. I am planning to stay in Livonia,
which is the opposite of my friend, Mr. Morrow. We moved here 30
years ago. We came from Washington D.C. We thought that the sun
rose and set on Arlington, Virginia, which is specifically where we
lived, and we came here not knowing a soul. We came here with
certain trepidation. We pictured Detroit as smokestacks on every
corner, and just a big, bustling, dirty City but we had the great, good
fortune of settling in Livonia where we have raised our family, and it
has just been a pleasure, although for the first 20 years we were takers.
For the last ten years my wife and I have both tried to give back to the
community, and we will continue to do that. I am not going away. I
15335
have asked the Mayor to consider me for other opportunities to serve,
and he said he would. With that I want to wish each of you well, and I
,,� used to close these meetings when I was Chairman, I used to say Good
Night Livonia. For the last time I want to say Good Night Livonia. I'll
see you on the golf course.
On a motion duly made, seconded and unanimously adopted, the 736th Regular Meeting
& Public Hearings held on December 10, 1996 was adjourned at 8:45 p.m.
CITY PLANNING COMMISSION
,. hn J. alsh, Acting Secretary
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ATTEST: ,c t�<° - �_
Jain es C. McCann, Chairman
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